The Nobility in Slut Shaming

Next month is the first anniversary of Slutwalk.  A feminist protest march against free-speech, self-responsibility and healthy fraternization between the sexes.  It is going to be interesting to see how many sluts come along to this year’s planned slutwalks and how many of them will, like myself, having reflected on the matter for a few months have come to the conclusion that supporting the original Slutwalk was one of the stupidest things I’ve ever done.

Before I get onto why slut shaming is a worthwhile and honourable pursuit in our society, I just want to quickly rehash why Slutwalk was anti-free speech, pro-irresponsibility and pro-sexual perversion.  Slutwalk started when a group of feminists got their knickers in a twist because a Toronto police constable said that “women should avoid dressing like sluts,” to reduce the risk of being raped or sexually assaulted.  Note that this police constable didn’t do anything, he only said something.  Also, he was a constable, not even a senior policeman.  He merely expressed his own opinion, which to me contains some sage advice: don’t bait the wolf if you want to be safe outside the village at night.  (Note: I have to say this, because some people seem to think I’m saying, “all men are wolves who would rape if they had a piece a jail-bait dangling in from of them,” I was using an analogy of irresponsibly behaviour, not making a suggestion that all men are sexual predators.  Some men do rape, the vast majority of men don’t rape and will actively intervene to prevent rape.)

The worldwide protests that erupted following this statement illustrate how insane the typical mainstream feminist is.  Street protests of this scale usually erupt because of something someone has done: start a war that kills many thousands of people, introduced a law that forces a significant proportion of the population to live in squalor or mismanaged billions of dollars of other people’s money.  You know, protests over something that someone has actually done, as opposed to merely something that someone has said.  To protest over someone else’s opinion, is to attempt to silence that person which is anti-free speech and therefore anti-democratic.  Also, when people protest a real issue, like the Vietnam war, civil rights or the protection of banks through public theft, the police usually jump in and start beating people senseless.  Ironically, the more justified their cause, the greater the police violence usually is: they actually shot people dead on university campuses for protesting the invasion of Cambodia.  When slutwalkers start getting beaten senseless by police or state-hired thugs, then I might start taking them seriously.  But the fact that no government took a slut walk down tells me that governments will endorse anyone who is anti-free speech.  I wonder if the state would beat up anti-“the 99%” street protestors?  Personally, I’m going to stand by Constable Michael Sanguinetti because he has the right to express his opinion even if the whole world disagrees with it, and frankly, I do agree with him, it was good advice.

The second point, is that slutwalkers are trying to get women exempt for being self-responsible.  They are effectively saying that men, not women, are responsible for protecting and keeping women safe which is chauvinist to the stratosphere.  Imagine we reversed the sexes.  Some men after walking home from a soccer match at which their team won and they notice a group of miserable looking drunk supporters of the losing team in a bar.  If the men from the winning team walked up to the losing team drowning their sorrows and started ridiculing them and waving their team’s victory in their face how sympathetic are you going to be if those men get the shit firmly kicked out of them?  I’m not saying that violence is acceptable, I’m saying, provoking a fight then complaining about the consequences is stupid and an irresponsible thing to do.  If a woman dresses like a slut, teases drunk and sexually frustrated men in a shady bar late at night, it doesn’t make the rape/sexual assault ok, but it does tell me that that woman is a stupid irresponsible twit, and honestly, I have has much sympathy for her as those soccer fans: nil.

Why? Because it isn’t logical to respect a person who won’t respect themselves.  Self-responsibility is self-respect.

If women want to be taken seriously in society, as equals to men, then they need to shoulder the same level of responsibility for their decisions as men do.  Slutwalks are nothing but organised public whinging sessions about how hard life is for women.  Life is hard for men too, but men can’t complain about it because men are “privileged,” supposedly.  The men have to grow a thicker skin and for the sake of freedom of speech, the slut walkers need to grow a thicker skin too and stop whingeing about a perfectly honourable activity: shaming sluts.

Slutwalk is pro-sexual irresponsibility.  To be clear, I’m a biologist and I’m fascinated with culture and sexual history.  I’m certain that being a polyamorous licentious troupe of sex crazed apes is our natural sexual behaviour as a species.  Nearly every nomadic human tribe studied loves a good public orgy with a terrifyingly low age of consent.  Being slutty is a human instinct.  However, we ain’t nomads anymore.  We now live in massively over populated cities with limited personal geographical mobility and more sexually transmitted diseases than ever before.  In many ways our lives are more dangerous now than they were ten thousand years ago and the sexual free-for-all days of our past are going to get us killed either by sexually transmitted diseases, failure to adequately provide for and nurture our children or our current inability to balance the state budget because the state is being forced to be a husband to “empowered women” who no longer take marriage seriously and choose to be dependent on the state instead of a husband.  Because it is more “empowering” to depend on a massive faceless state machine for protection and money than to depend on a man you can talk with, if and when, you want to, excuse my sarcasm.

Sleeping around with whomever you like, whenever you like, is fine, so long as you don’t consider the consequences.  The consequences of being a slut are: contracting an STD, infecting other people with your STDs, getting pregnant, getting pregnant to a stranger, getting pregnant to someone other than your husband and getting pregnant without a husband or without adequate family/community support to raise a child.  Those are some pretty damn serious consequences for being a slut, and they don’t just affect men.

Reasons why men and women want to publicly shame sluts:

1. A warning to others: By publicly calling out a person as a slut one is doing a public service.  One is spreading useful information about a person.  Men informing other men of a woman’s sluttiness are telling them she might carry STDs, she’s quite likely to commit paternity fraud and she’s a risk of “accidental” pregnancy.  They aren’t necessarily saying, “don’t go out with her,” they may merely be saying, “be careful, she’s dangerous, she might do more harm than just hurt your feelings.”  Women might also publicly call out a slut because they care about reducing the spread of STDs and the cost to society, both financially and socially, of single mothers.  I’m sure there are plenty of responsible working women out there who feel frustrated they’re paying higher taxes so the government can mitigate the consequences other women’s irresponsible sexual behaviour.

2. An incentive to change ones behaviour: Public shaming, is used with children all the time as an incentive to stop harmful behaviour like starting fights; breaking other children’s toys, crying wolf, etcetera.  Interestingly, it still works with adults, perhaps even more effectively than with children, yet it is not politically correct to publicly shame an adult because, who knows, it might hurt someone’s political career to expose them as a lying scumbag or a paedophile (never mind the victims of lying politicians or paedophiles).  Publicly shaming sluts teaches them to be more sexually responsible which is a good thing.  If you think being sexually irresponsible isn’t bad, you really need to tell someone with HIV, herpes, crippling child support payments, or a single mother living in a slum with several children from several different men.

3. A deterrent to future sluts: When a slut is publicly humiliated, the future slut-wannabes watching this humiliation get it explained to them, in no uncertain terms, that being a slut is not a good thing to be.  It will make them think about it more, they’ll think about the consequences of their actions and, lo and behold, they might practice responsible sex.

4. As revenge or to eliminate a sexual rival: Sometimes people do slut shame for the wrong reasons.  Either they shame someone who isn’t a slut, which is being dishonest or in old fashioned speak “dishonourable” (back in the day when people had a sense of honour), or they call someone out as a slut purely to eliminate them as a sexual rival.  While the latter is selfish, it’s doing the right thing for the wrong reasons so it doesn’t bother me that much.  However, the former, calling slut when a person isn’t a slut is a serious offence.

Of these four reasons why someone would call someone else out as a slut, three of them are wholesome and valid reasons, only the last one isn’t.  Feminism wants us to throw away a noble and honourable social practice of slut shaming because it might be misused.  Well, everything can be misused, should we ban plastic bags because they can kill?  Should we ban bath tubs because people can drown in them?  Should we ban language because it allows people to lie?  Get a fucking reality check: a slut is not a good thing to be and if you are a slut, you should feel ashamed for yourself.

However, this attitude of it’s ok to be a slut was displayed again recently by the feminist lobby when they censured Rush Limbaugh, or rather by using political intimidation, denied him his right to freedom of speech.  Rush Limbaugh was right, they are selfish sluts, when the feminist lobby say they want the government to pay for their contraception (which isn’t a necessity) they are saying that they expect the tax payers (mostly men) to protect them against their irresponsibility for no gratitude.  Even as the United States is being crushed by toxic levels of debt, the feminist lobby still care more about their own personal interests over the interests of their community: that is to say, “fuck society, I only care about me.”  That’s the narcissistic corrupt mentality that John F. Kennedy was talking about when he said, “Ask not, what your country can do for you, but what you can do for your country.”

A slut only thinks about their immediate pleasure, they don’t think about the consequences of their actions, if they did, they wouldn’t act so irresponsibly.

If there was not a risk of STDs (found in closed hygienic tribal communities), no risk of pregnancy or in the case of pregnancy that the child was assured a strong community to support and raise the child (found in a tight-knit tribal community) and if paternity fraud wasn’t a concern of the father (found in a tight-knit tribal community) then it is easy to understand why being a slut was par for the course in prehistoric nomadic times for the human species.  But we don’t live in nomadic times anymore.  It’s a dangerous, complicated and ruthless world, and the best defence is to be responsible and to act responsibly, and that’s going to have to mean using a lot more self-control than is comfortable most of the time.  But you either accept that, or you accept that sooner or later your irresponsible decisions will eventually kill you, if not countless others collaterally, on the way to your eventual demise.  I hope you don’t feel shy calling out a slut the next time you see one, if there’s an irresponsible nitwit in our community, letting everyone else know is the most responsible thing you can do.

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Categories: Beliefs, Morals, Events, Gender issues, People

Author:Jason Sutherland

Resist the temptation to assume that you're always right or wrong. Never succumb to thinking you're so insignificant to trust your own thoughts and feelings. Always be responsible and listen carefully to others before passing judgement. Don't trust governments bearing stolen goods.

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485 Comments on “The Nobility in Slut Shaming”

  1. James Hill
    March 18, 2012 at 1:49 pm #

    Most of the “slut shaming” I hear about is directed at women by other women. Sexual promiscuity by anyone threatens existing relationships and most women are eager to prevent that. It’s not an accident that the sexual revolution came along with skyrocketing divorce rates and illegitimacy, which have had disastrous effects for society at large. “Slutty” behaviour by either gender threatens the traditional family unit and, by extension, society at large.

    I think this is a symptom of a much larger problem though. We’re a society obsessed with youth and most young people these days enjoy a period of extended adolescence well into their 20’s. Sexual experimentation and brief, but intense flings are the hallmarks of adolescence, but when practiced to excess harm the individual and their ability to form genuine, deep romantic bonds.

    • March 18, 2012 at 2:04 pm #

      I couldn’t agree with you more if I tried. It is only a symptom. We’re a society that protects narcissists and their inability to cope with the fact that they can and do make mistakes like everyone else. Part of growing up is accepting that you’re not perfect, life isn’t perfect, but you can still make a good living and be a good person despite all the bad things that exist within us and around us.

      • bresner23
        March 29, 2012 at 5:35 am #

        The laughable nature of slutwalk finally exposed on film: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y5OdQGbVNa4

      • Jen B
        September 7, 2012 at 10:20 pm #

        The whole point of the slut walk was to high-light the issues of victim blaming when it comes to rape. The police officer made remarks suggesting that women could avoid rape by not dressing like sluts. Hence the use of the word “slut” in slut walk. This is called VICTIM BLAMING.
        Slut walk is about saying I should be able to dress how I like, completely covered head to toe or wear low cut tops and short skirts, without fear of being rape or being blamed for the rape because of the clothes am wearing or how many sexual partners I may have had (oh, btw, none of your business).
        Victim blaming is the main reason why the vast majority of victims of rape do not report the crime. Victim blaming silences people and give’s the rapist an excuse for their behaviour.
        The only person responsible for rape is the rapist. Not clothes, being drunk, sexual history, flirting, make up, walking home at night, being on a late night train, etc, ect, ect

        Slut shaming is just as hideous and contributes, among many things, to the notion that victims of rape can be held responsible for the rape because of their sexual history.
        It is really no-ones business how many sexual partners a woman has had. Consensual sex is good rape is bad.

        • September 8, 2012 at 12:53 am #

          Dear Jen B, I have some urgent information to impart to you: you’re an idiot. Seriously, read my article, don’t go off on some feminist moral masturbation trip, actually think about what I wrote and what I’m saying. Repeating what other people have said over and over isn’t evidence of a brain, merely evidence of cognitive automation.

          Do you seriously think being a slut is a good thing? Do you seriously think promoting ‘sluthood’ is going to improve the already appalling impression feminists give the world about the female of the species?

          We make a distinction between sluts and ladies for a good reason: ladies are to be respected and admired while sluts are to be used and dumped. That’s all they’re there for, and sluts self-select themselves for this purpose. If they had integrity and self-respect then they wouldn’t be sluts. Every time you demand that sluts be treated like ladies, you insult decent women everywhere. Women like you are an embarrassment to womanhood. Slutwalk convinced far more women that they didn’t want to have anything to do with feminism than it did winning converts to your sick religion of female deification.

          About 4,000 people joined the ranks of the MRM last month over the Monash posters, but not even 12 women could be rallied to a meeting to discuss it. The writing is on the wall: feminism is dying fast.

          • Ty
            September 8, 2012 at 1:08 am #

            Dear Jason S,

            You are a bully. You alternate between accusing people of being illogical and using ad hominem. You seek to socially ostracize people who disagree with your world view. ‘Sluts’ do not self-select to be “used and dumped”. “Women like you are an embarrassment” — how does this attack prove any point you are trying to make?

            • September 8, 2012 at 1:26 am #

              Ty, is a school teacher who tells a student off for lying a bully? How about a police man who tells someone off for threatening someone? I know this make shake your fragile pacifist mind up, but telling people off for bad and stupid behaviour is a perfectly legitimate way of interacting with someone.

              If I wanted something out of Ms. Jen B and I was harrassing her unprovoked, then yes, I would be a Bully. But I’m not. So stop raping the English language and grow a pair.

              So let me get this straight, your worldview is that if we ever disagree, I can’t complain, but you can if I do? Umm… yeah. No thanks. Conflict is actually a perfectly natural and healthy part of life. Unless you’re a weakling who’s made of glass…

              I made this attack with good reason, “Slut shaming is just as hideous” is a comment that is deeply offensive to every woman who has self-control. Sluts are not good people. They are fundamentally incapable of being constructive members of a civilised society. I will not let this kind of insult against mature womanhood be made unchallenged.

              If you think sluts have something constructive to contribute to society other than to allow some men occasional sexual release, then explain it to me.

              • Ty
                September 8, 2012 at 2:10 am #

                Jason, don’t worry, I can explain this to you. What would make a school teacher a bully in your scenario is whether or not they were rude or pejorative when they explained something. Even if they were as logically or factually misguided as you are, they would still not be a bully if they weren’t using a position of authority to diminish expression or vilify viewpoints.

                Since you seem to think of yourself as a teacher, I hope you are a math teacher, or maybe a theater teacher. Civics and history obviously are not your strong point, since you weren’t aware of the fourth amendment to the constitution of the United States of America. “I’m fascinate though by this “right” to be “secure in person”, I’ve never heard of it.” — You said that!!! How funny!!! — You also seem to have problems with grammar, so not an english teacher either. Maybe you are a philosophy teacher, like Socrates… but Socrates wouldn’t use straw man argument’s like you do. He also didn’t call people names. Other than, maybe, Cretons.

                • September 8, 2012 at 8:59 am #

                  Hang on, I thought you were going to explain it to me, but instead you just launched into infantile mocking and ad hominem. Let me look at this again, hmm, no, I don’t see an explanation… Just pseudo-elitist nit-picking about a typo and me not being American. I wonder if you know more about the Australian constitution than I do since you’re so learned?

                  Maybe you could explain to me why being rude and pejorative is so wrong, without destroying my first amendment rights? I won’t hold my breath though because you haven’t shown much imagination yet. Also, please explain why it is ok for you to mock my work and myself but not ok for me to treat you with the same disrespect? You’re doing a lot of projection here…

              • KBev
                March 11, 2013 at 5:35 am #

                The point you are implying is that women are sexual objects. “Ladies” are good sexual objects, and “sluts” are bad sexual objects.
                Saying that “sluts are not good people” or that they are “incapable of being constructive members of society” means that a person’s worth (in this case, a female) stems from her sexual purity.
                A person with multiple sexual partners can be a productive member of society, male or female.

                • March 11, 2013 at 7:04 am #

                  You use the term “sexual object” but I do not think it means what you think it means. It merely adds an extra quality onto all the existing qualities, it takes nothing away. Consider that men, cats, earwigs, ants and trees are also sexual objects. To label something a sexual object is often just a banal statement of fact. It speaks volumes that feminist writers are amused by such tiny revelations about human nature.

                  Everything else you wrote extends from a faulty understanding and is not worthy of response.

          • Verna
            January 19, 2013 at 7:43 am #

            At Jason, YOU are the idiot. I watched you on Dr Phil and you the most calm, composed total moron I’ve ever seen. You claim to know women are sluts because more than one of your friends slept with them so, what did you do to shame those friends? Oh wait, they’re guys , right?

            You are the one insulting to women and men alike. You give decent men a bad name, men who judge a woman by her personality and not what she looks like. Of course, Is that all a woman is to you? Her sexual lifestyle?

            I understand that you probably couldn’t pay a woman enough to sleep with you but that doesn’t mean that you have to take it out on the women. Maybe if you weren’t such a judgmental jacka$$, you’d have sex every couple of years.

            On top of that, you are another one of those people ignorant enough to think that rape is about sex, it isn’t. Anyone with a brain would tell you it’s about control. Just like you are. You can’t have women in the bedroom so you try to control them outside of the bedroom. Maybe you just need a good blow up doll!

          • Verna
            January 26, 2013 at 10:40 am #

            You are an embarrassment to manhood. You have no “higher” purpose. You aren’t Helping anyone. You are only taking out your angst and trying to make it okay for every other dweeby little virgin guy to do the same.

            You obviously have a problem with feminists and are just using this as a way to make yourself feel like a man.

            By the way, on Dr Phil you said you know a woman is a slut when more than one of your friends has slept with them. Doesn’t that make them sluts too. Did you have the balls to tell them off and explain to them how they should be living, according to you? I seriously doubt it. You hide behind a keyboard and would never have the nerve to confront a man and tell him how you think he should be conducting himself.

            By the way, Jason, not all women that dress modestly are ladies, and not all woman that dress provocatively are promiscuous.

            You must not have ever learned this in your mother’s basement but, there is more to a person than how they dress.

        • Liiboux
          December 30, 2012 at 9:46 am #

          So if I were to go walk down the street of a black neighborhood in a klansmen robe, I am in no way accountable for what ever violent acts may happen to me?

          • Verna
            January 19, 2013 at 7:44 am #

            Totally off topic and doesn’t pertain at all. But excellent rapist mentality.

    • April 5, 2013 at 9:54 am #

      Yo dudes. Ever had sex just for pleasure? Then why are you pissed about “the feminist lobby say[ing] they want the government to pay for their contraception”? I assume you don’t want risk fathering a child every time you have sex.

  2. Laura M
    March 18, 2012 at 11:48 pm #

    Just open a can of worms here, when I read you talking about “sluts” and the problem with “sluts” you refer to all of them as women. Therefore, are you saying that it is okay for men to sleep around but not women? Can a man be a slut?

    Men carry stds as well, and cause unwanted pregnancies – it takes two to tango. The only reason that the unwanted pregnancy can the women’s issue than a man’s is that the man is able to run off and leave them woman with the baby. He can even have a one night stand, leave a fake number and not even know that he has fathered a child. It happens. It comes down to the woman’s responsibility as the child is there and in her body whether she wants it there or not. This is not just a simple gender issue – both sexes need to take responsibility for these issues, not just one.

    What concerns me is that his article completely shames and degrades all women, especially single mothers. There can be many reasons for a woman being a single mother. This article, whether you meant it or not, made all single mothers come across as loose women, with no morals, who are trying to cheat the welfare system.

    Jason – I challenge you to write an article that does not completely degrade a shame women. In trying to “balance the issues” you are just degrading women completely. It upsets me, not as a woman but as a PERSON.

    • March 19, 2012 at 12:08 am #

      Very decent point, Laura on the equal – or rather unequal – status of men’s behavior / morals.

    • March 19, 2012 at 6:44 am #

      But Laura, this is in response to Slutwalk, a feminist protest purely about a woman’s right to be a slut but men need to repress their sexually completely for women’s comfort so of course I’m focussing on women.

      Men aren’t allowed to be sluts (sleazes), they aren’t allowed to even ask women out for a drink in an elevator without being considered creeps or sexual predators. There certainly is no call for a sleaze walk. If men wear skin tight clothes or fish nets society judges them far more harshly than when women do it. Where the hell do you get this idea that it’s ok in our society for men to be sleazes?

      Where do I shame single mothers? I pointed out that their lives are harder than other peoples. If you’re referring to the slut implication then maybe their harder lives are their own fault? Why are single mother’s exempt from the shame of making bad decisions? Because they have a vagina? If so that’s some serious prejudice and I have to wonder do you automatically blame the man for the single mother’s bad decisions?

      Remember, it’s her body, her choice and her responsibility. That last bit keeps being left out for some reason.

      I’m glad you brought up that men get STDs too, after the HPV vaccine incident I was starting to think people seriously only thought women got STDs and suffered from them. HPV kills at least as many men as women yet only women got the free vaccine and health warnings. But who cares about the men?

      Yes, sleazes are bad, however, besides the STD issue the men can’t cause as much suffering as the women can. Paternity fraud is a serious problem and it’s getting worse, not better.

      • March 19, 2012 at 10:29 am #

        “Men… aren’t allowed to even ask women out for a drink in an elevator without being considered creeps or sexual predators.”

        I would have no problem asking out a girl for a drink in an elevator. If I get turned down, that doesn’t mean I’m considered a creep or a sexual predator. If I thought it did, then I have some serious self-esteem problems. But I don’t.

        This is biology / nature. Men are wired to be proactive and seek out women via attractiveness, make the first move, etc. We are also wired to be shot down many times before we succeed (unless you’re George Clooney).

        Women are equally wired to remain passive and play hard-to-get while flaunt themselves to a subjective degree. But males flaunt themselves, too. We both flaunt ourselves differently on a night out, completely in line with what we instinctively know appeals most to our opposite sex. Biologically, men and women behave completely in line with what they are supposed to do. Women and men, both also want to look as attractive as possible. It’s hard-wired into our brains to do this. To try and admonish one sex for doing this is to go against nature.

        • March 19, 2012 at 3:46 pm #

          The elevator comment was a reference to the “Richard Dawkins versus Rebecca Watson” affair. Rebecca Watson said that it was predatory behaviour almost equivalent to sexual assault for men to ask women out in an elevator. Richard Dawkins called bullshit on her and said he was just a polite man, who asked an attractive woman if she’d like to have a drink with him and when she said no, he took her rejection calmly and with dignity. This started an online war between the fans of the respective public figures.

          I’m not convinced at all that men are /wired/ one way and women the other for those particular tactics, but certainly those are the expectations. There are plently of very sexually aggressive women out there. Based on the domestic violence statistics I’m thinking that women are equally likely to be physically aggressive/violent as men are. However, I think women are psychologically far less capable battle than men are. So I’m saying, men and women are just as likely to start throwing punches when riled up, but in a full blown melee the men will nearly always be victorious. Conversely, men suck compared to a women at detecting decension in the ranks around them.

          However, even though women might have some innate advantages at understanding social warfare, I think it is prudent for every men to study learn as much about who other people think, behave and communicate together, lest he be taken advantage of. Women could also gain a great deal from learning to appreciate the military virtues too.

        • Belle
          May 14, 2012 at 6:25 pm #

          Look, I believe Rebecca Watson was justified in feeling threatened by being propositioned by a strange man in an elevator – I would feel the same way. We are in a society that sends the message that it’s not a man’s responsibility to not rape, but rather a woman’s responsibility to not get raped. The onus is on women to be ‘proactive’ in protecting themselves from ‘wolves’. Jason echoes this sentiment in the article. So, you want women to protect themselves from potentially dangerous situations, but you’ll defend men who contribute to making women feel like they’re in a potentially dangerous situation? You can’t have it both ways. If I’m alone at night, or just alone in a sparsely populated area, I treat EVERY man I see as a potential rapist/attacker. Why? Because society tells me that I have to protect myself – it’s my job to stop my rape. Men shouldn’t take it personally, I don’t actually believe every man I see IS a rapist, but I don’t make eye contact, keep my distance, and hold my car keys like a makeshift shank – just in case. So, my advice is, if you want to approach a woman and proposition her for a drink or date or whatever, DON’T do it in a place that might make her feel uncomfortable. No enclosed spaces and no dark streets.

          • May 14, 2012 at 7:22 pm #

            Belle you insult every person who has actually been raped with these comments. You’re a hypersensitive spoiled brat, not a brave warrior struggling to make it in a hostile male dominated world. The vast majority of men aren’t simply harmless to women, they’ve actively helpful and protective to women even when they’re being unfairly provoked by women. Your delusions of living in a world populated by dangerous men are just that, a self-indulgent fantasy world that enables you to cast yourself as a poor struggling victim trying to get by. You want to be a victim because victims get care, attention and gifts just for the fact that are victims. You are not a victim, you are a parasite on society’s arse.

            Get over your self-selected victimhood and take responsibility for your own life, don’t wait around for the world to fix itself around you. You’ll be old soon, then you’ll discover something else about men, they don’t even pay attention at all to old bitter women.

            • Belle
              May 15, 2012 at 3:12 pm #

              I’m so confused, Jason. You seem to want women to show ‘self-responsibility’ and take it upon themselves to not ‘bait the wolf if [they] want to be safe outside the village at night’. But when I say that I take responsibility for my own personal safety by not getting into situations where I might be in danger, suddenly that makes me a ‘spoilt brat’ and a ‘parasite’ that has a ‘victim mentality’ (so much for civil, polite discourse). Is it just that you think women should only act responsibility around rapists? Which is easy because they all have big, neon flashing signs above their heads…. oh wait, no they don’t… hmm, this is a tricky one. You’re hypocrisy and contradictions are breathtaking. Just clarify for me Jason, do you want women to be responsible for their own safety or not?

              Also, if you had reading comprehension skills, you’d see that I said “I don’t actually believe every man I see IS a rapist”, so your assertion that I think I live in a world populated by dangerous men is stupid. Personally, I think it is better to be safe than sorry. I have never been the victim of abuse or assault from a male, but I potentially came very close one night – and what saved me? My assumption that the two men I saw where not to be trusted. I was driving home alone after a party one night at about 4am. I stopped at a red light (I was the only car around) and I turn to see that there were two young men standing on the side of the road next to my car, just staring at me. One lowered his head to look into my car and then it just didn’t feel right so I locked my doors (thank god for central locking), and as soon as I did that they bolted towards my car, one of them trying to yank the passenger door open whilst the other was running around the back of my car – presumably to get to the drivers door where my window was half down. I quickly scanned the intersection and then floored it through the red light before he could reach my window. Needless to say, I was pretty shaken up after that. Now, if I hadn’t assumed the worst from those guys, I wouldn’t have locked my doors and there would’ve been a real chance that the first guy could have opened my passenger door before I had a chance to react. So no, I don’t feel like a victim but I also don’t feel guilty about treating men suspiciously in certain situations. I’m sorry that upsets you Jason, but I care more about my personal safety than some random man’s feelings – not that it would be very obvious to any man who passed me in public that I was cautious of him. I’m sure I look like anyone else just minding their own business.

              I’m also confused as to how I insulted every person who has been raped with my comments. I have the utmost sympathy for victims of rape – regardless of what they were doing or what they were wearing the the time of the assault – unlike you.

            • Verna
              January 19, 2013 at 8:28 am #

              You are so incredibly out of touch, Jason. I would say in a dark parking lot, alley, what ever, Belle is completely right. That is where rapists lurk mostly so, she has every right to think that that is the time to be very cautious.

              You seem to think you know all about women, what it’s like, how we feel, how we should dress, how we should act. Yet, after seeing you on Dr Phil, I doubt more than a half dozen women have ever touched you your whole life.

              You are judgmental, condescending, lacking common sense and just plain a pain. On top of that you are a dufus. What life experience do you have that makes you think you have any clue what you’re talking about? My 17 year old son knows more about women than you do, because we talk. Did your mother ever talk to you? Does she condone you thinking you are the be all and end all on how women should act? Or is she just hoping that it won’t be much longer before you lose your virginity?

            • Anonymous
              March 11, 2013 at 1:56 am #

              Jason,
              As a woman who HAS been raped, Bella is completely correct here.
              You know nothing (or choose not to know) about societal conditioning of women in order to live in your silly little fantasy world that allows you to paint women as laughable, evil, conniving, loose harpies.
              And to your last point, (‘ You’ll be old soon, then you’ll discover something else about men, they don’t even pay attention at all to old bitter women’) it would do you well to consider that women’s lives don’t necessarily revolve around trying to get men’s attention. That’s just a thing that you tell yourself in order to feel like someone might someday need you for something in your life.

              • March 11, 2013 at 7:00 am #

                Whether or not you have been raped is irrelevant to this discussion. You don’t need to be raped to have a valid point of view. The fact that you’re bringing it up here is merely to get sensationalist attention for yourself. Feminists will where a rape like a badge of honour, “here look at me, I’m a victim of the war against men!”

                My point about being considered worthless by men means: no protection, no children and no money. Women have duties to perform in society and having children is just one of them, by failing to marry, have children and to support your fellow man you have declared yourself a freeloader on society and come retirement you will have no family to take care of you in the grey years. Your friends won’t be able or have time to look after you, that’s what kids and family are for. Right now you’re banking everything in your future on the government and welfare state still existing in the future. If you look at the economic situation globally right now, and actually spent as much time trying to understand it as feminist theory you’d realised you’re fucked and you’d better find a good man to protect and look after you when the collapse occurs.

            • Kelly O'Neil
              May 24, 2013 at 11:53 am #

              You’ve obviously never been victimized. The slutwalk movement isn’t a crazy man-hating neo-feminist movement, it was started to give a voice to victims of rape culture. That includes men too. As a side note, it’s not anti-free speech, that would only be a valid argument if it was aimed at punishing the officer for what he said or forcibly preventing others from expressing similar opinions. This movement is aimed at spreading awareness which will hopefully reduce overall ignorance including comments like this. He has the right to say whatever he wants, just as you had the right to publish this hate filled article. Just because you have freedom of speech doesn’t mean you have protection from the thoughts of those who oppose your opinions.

          • heratyck
            May 14, 2012 at 10:52 pm #

            “Because society tells me that I have to protect myself – it’s my job to stop my rape.”

            While I do give you credit for taking responsibility for your own safety and well being, it’s statements like this that just blow my mind. Stop *your* rape? You talk as though it’s guaranteed… like every woman is a walking rape victim and it’s just a matter of when and where. Not only that, but you take ownership of this inevitability by referring to it as *my rape*. Do you not see how this type of thinking feeds into the victim mindset?

            I know in some cases it may be little more than a matter of semantics, but I’m a big believer in being careful of what you claim ownership of. Because whenever we claim something as “mine”, we have a tendency to incorporate that thing into our self concept/identity. Yes, it’s good to assert your boundaries. And yes, it’s good to be wary of certain situations or people, but you can do so without seeing yourself as an inevitable victim.

            • Belle
              May 15, 2012 at 3:28 pm #

              Stop putting superfluous meaning onto my words. When I say ‘my rape’, clearly it means ‘rape that would happen to me’ – in the event that I was raped. If I had changed that sentence to “it’s my job to stop rape” or “it’s my job to stop a rape”, it would not have been clear that I was referring to myself as the recipient of the act. Also, a rape would be something done to me if I was the victim, so how could I possible ‘own’ it? Your comments make no sense to me. There is also nowhere where I suggest that I absolutely expect to be raped one day. That’s absolutely ridiculous. You guys want women to be responsible and assertive when it comes to their own safety, but then you turn around and tell us we have victim mentality if we do just that. I have never been and victim and as such, I don’t consider myself one. That does not mean I don’t take proactive steps to keep myself safe.

              • heratyck
                May 16, 2012 at 2:25 am #

                “If I had changed that sentence to “it’s my job to stop rape” or “it’s my job to stop a rape”, it would not have been clear that I was referring to myself as the recipient of the act.”

                I dunno… What about “it’s my job to prevent someone from sexually assaulting me” or “it’s my job to protect myself”?

                “Also, a rape would be something done to me if I was the victim, so how could I possible ‘own’ it? Your comments make no sense to me.”

                You are correct. A rape is done to a person, and (IMO) is not something to be owned or identified with. Nonetheless, we all have experiences that we take “psychological ownership” of, referring to them possessively (my/mine/ours) which often leads us to incorporate those things into our sense of identity. Which isn’t necessarily a bad thing… unless the experience happens to be something traumatic. I see so many young women using the term “my rape” to describe sexual assault, and (as I said before) in some cases it may be little more than a case of semantics… However, I think that referring to traumatic experiences (either past or potential) in a first-person possessive/present tense kind of way can sometimes feed into a maladaptive sort of relationship between the person and the experience/idea.

                “You guys want women to be responsible and assertive when it comes to their own safety, but then you turn around and tell us we have victim mentality if we do just that.”

                What do you mean by “you guys”?

        • Verna
          January 19, 2013 at 8:23 am #

          Andrew, the voice of reason. What a smart, honest, thoughtful person you are. I hope you have, or find, someone very special to you.

      • March 19, 2012 at 10:35 am #

        Single mothers – an issue unto itself – Jason has a point too, I mean in 2012 we see divorce well in excess of couples staying together, and of these where a child is involved, the statistics are still that ~50% of divorces are initiated:

        — by the wife – by choice – (not by ‘no other choice’)
        — by the husband – by ‘no other choice’.

        ie: the wife is not always the victim of “a man she just had to leave”.

        • James Hill
          March 19, 2012 at 3:22 pm #

          Western society has adopted a disposable attitude to relationships and sexual partners. There is zero stigma associated with children born out of wedlock and women without careers can still expect to be financially provided for by their ex partners under many divorce agreements. Where is the incentive to stay and work through the bad patches in a relationship, especially when all your friends are out partying and having a good time?

        • March 19, 2012 at 3:50 pm #

          In the USA 70% of divorces are initiated by the wife and only a fraction of them cite domestic violence as the reason. The most common reason given is “dissatisfaction.” Which I think is a cop out. I thought marriage was about commitment, sacrifice and learning to work together, not about a woman living the good life at a man’s expense. How many men divorce their wives because they’re dissatisfied with her performance? Women are valued by who they are, men are only valued for what they can do.

          • Verna
            January 19, 2013 at 8:13 am #

            What a load of crap, Jason. How many men stay married but have an affair? Oh, I forgot, men can do that and it’s no big deal.

            Don’t try to give us the single white male boo hoo’s. We’ve felt enough prejudice and you don’t have any clue what that’s about. If you did, you wouldn’t be so quick to judge others.

      • Laura M
        March 19, 2012 at 6:49 pm #

        Of course this is a response to slutwalk and that is what I am responding to. The point of the whole movement, handled badly I think, is that it is never the fault of the victim of sexual assault, not matter how she was dressed. If we are saying that a woman is at fault because of how she dresses then we should get all women into a burqa and be done with it. That way we can completely protect men from their uncontrolled urges! What complete bull. A man, or woman, is totally responsible for the way they act. If a guy chooses to grab some girls ass or breasts or force himself on her then he cannot blame the woman.

        “Men… aren’t allowed to even ask women out for a drink in an elevator without being considered creeps or sexual predators.”

        Oh come on Jason! I have no problem with men coming up and starting a conversation with me at a bar, or asking to buy me a drink. What I do have a problem with is being grabbed on my breasts or my arse, sticking their tongue down my throat, rubbing themselves up against me, revealing their bits all because I said no. Quite recently I told a guy I didn’t want to go home with him and he forced himself into my cab anyway, refusing to get out and leaving me wondering whether to jump out of the cab in the middle of nowhere at the next red light or just risking it and continuing the journey home. I am sure that I am not the only woman with these sorts of stories. And you know what, it is not my fault that the guy behaved that way. I refuse to take responsibility for his disgusting actions as you seem to think I should.

        Unwanted sexual attention is a no no. No matter what I wear. I happen to dress quite modestly and if the attitude is that some guy grabbing my breasts is my fault as I happen to be quite well endowed then I think there is a major problem with society. Is this what is considered chivalry these days? Is this what it means to be a man? Because I am telling you,that is what I see more often than not when I am out with my girlfriends.

        My other question for you is, what defines a slut? You say in your article that calling a woman as slut is noble. I ask you, how do you know? How do you know how many sexual partners a woman or man has had. And more importantly, why is that any of your business? If you are saying that you can tell just by looking at a woman whether or not she is, as you term, a slut, then I would say you have some crazy mind reading powers. Either that or you are, as I think you probably are, judging her based on how she is. How is calling someone a horrible, derogatory name noble?

        • April 4, 2012 at 9:09 am #

          I could tell you what I think about this, but I’m a man so you won’t listen to me. So here’s a woman saying exactly what I would say:

          • April 16, 2012 at 4:51 pm #

            LOVED this video, particularly interesting was the biological discussion of how a man is judged as sexy and objectified by women, and how this hugely differs to how men find women attractive. For all would-be viewers this is around the 8:30 minute mark. Highly recommended viewing!

            • April 19, 2012 at 8:26 pm #

              GirlWritesWhat is made of awesome. I recommend all of her videos. She’s also one of the hosts for A Voice for Men radio, she’s on Thursdays with JtO.

          • zeeanna
            April 25, 2012 at 3:16 pm #

            There are several things you’ve presented in this article that I do actually agree with but I think you’re general stance on women is not one of equality & mutual respect. This in turn makes me question your reasoning for pronouncing a “nobility in slut shaming”.

            Evidence of your bias: “women should take some responsibility for their own safety, just like men are expected to?”, granted, yet your whole article is structured around the horrid reality of the sexual promiscuity of women. Where in this discussion does it even begin to include the responsibilities of all these MEN who partake in said sexual encounters. It seems ridiculously one-sided to speak of one sex’s physical activities without taking into account the opposing party. Women do not simply become “sluts” without a male to perform these acts. (I know that you state this reasoning in your reply but I don’t think it’s enough to tie the validity of your argument over.)

            From my experience the vast majority of people in my social circle who have admitted to having numerous sexual partners are male. Along with the countless stories of people I do not directly know, who are also male. All the points you have made against women, & the unproductive/unhealthy nature of promiscuousness remain valid, yet where do men step up & take some of this blame?

            I was going to overlook these biases & still continue to regard your opinions with some manner of respect until I continued to read the following reply, in which you clearly convey a deep-seated prejudice against women in general – underlined by the following statement’s assumptions:

            “I could tell you what I think about this, but I’m a man so you won’t listen to me.”

            I’m a woman, you’re a man; I am most certainly listening to you. I just can’t say I like what I’m hearing. You’re voicing an extremely contentious issue, with some pretty aggressive proclamations, that doesn’t even begin to attempt a mutual level of respect for both sexes.

            Unimpressed.

            • April 25, 2012 at 3:28 pm #

              Two points:

              1. You might have missed me saying, “This is in response to Slutwalk, a feminist protest purely about a woman’s right to be a slut but men need to repress their sexually completely for women’s comfort so of course I’m focussing on women.”

              2. I was clearly referring to a specific woman, not to all women.

              If you want me to hear me some unsavoury things about women, sure I say such things all the time. But I also say some unsavoury things about men too. The thing is, just because someone says something negative about women doesn’t mean that they hate women, consider that there are plenty of predatory men who endlessly say nice things about women but are utter arseholes. Do you instantly trust any man who says you’re beauitful? So why would you instantly feel unsafe around a man who says he finds women mendacious? My first thought, if I was a woman, might well be, “Good, a man with some intelligence.”

              • Verna
                January 19, 2013 at 8:34 am #

                There you go again , acting as if you’re a woman. You have no clue what a woman thinks when she hears that or anything else. You should try acting like you know something , about a topic you Actually know something about.

          • Verna
            January 19, 2013 at 8:30 am #

            The people on here not listening to you aren’t doing so because you’re a man. They’re doing it because you”re an idiot, or at least that’s my reason.

        • April 17, 2012 at 12:58 am #

          Laura I think you’re confused beyond belief.

          If a woman dresses like a slut then YES! I think she needs to accept that she is at least partially at fault for the predators attention being focused on her. Why her? Why that particular woman? It’s obviously what she was going for, even if it was subconcious…attention. It’s not 100% her fault she received it in excess but still it’s like advertising ice water in the summer and being surprised when someone takes you up on it. Or advertising it, then insisting they can’t have any, and being surprised when they take it.

          As for women bemoaning ‘where has chivalry gone?’ Are you serious? I’ll tell you…we killed it. Every time a reasonable woman listens to a feminist hate rant we throw another shovel of dirt in its grave. Either the sexes are equal or chivalry exists. It’s a binary situation. Women that say things like that are wanting to be equal and then some. For really…if we’re the same as men wouldn’t it follow that we wouldn’t be treated any differently than a man would treat another man?

          I’ll tell you what’s become the idea chivalry is in this day and age. It’s women thinking that men need to worship the ground they walk on. It’s women thinking that all men should suffer from vagina envy. It’s women wanting to be the more equal animal.

          In a society where men are now the oppressed sex is it any wonder that some act out. That some despise women and have no respect for them. Why is it that women don’t need to earn respect but simply expect it as their due?

          The man in the cab you spoke about…did he just walk up to you and spotaneously ask you to go home with him? Or had you talked with him, let him buy you a few drinks, and let him think he was making an investment. For that matter what’s your idea of ‘dressing modestly’? As you were in a cab and there was presumbably a driver, it sounds to me like you were in no real immediate danger. Yes, it sounds like an uncomfortable situation but I think it’s the rare man who walks up to a perfect stranger and is that aggressive without some sort of previous encouraging contact.

        • April 20, 2012 at 3:38 pm #

          I agree on this point:
          “My other question for you is, what defines a slut? You say in your article that calling a woman as slut is noble. I ask you, how do you know? How do you know how many sexual partners a woman or man has had. And more importantly, why is that any of your business? If you are saying that you can tell just by looking at a woman whether or not she is, as you term, a slut, then I would say you have some crazy mind reading powers. Either that or you are, as I think you probably are, judging her based on how she is. How is calling someone a horrible, derogatory name noble?”

      • Kathy
        May 14, 2012 at 8:03 pm #

        ‘Slutwalk, a feminist protest purely about a woman’s right to be a slut but men need to repress their sexually completely for women’s comfort so of course I’m focussing on women.’

        If women force men to repress their sexuality completely…how are there sluts in the first place?

        I think you’re confusing ‘sexuality’ with ‘violent and misogynistic sexual attacks’.

        • May 14, 2012 at 8:19 pm #

          Ok, what you’ve done here is taken a definition claim for a concept, namely ‘slutwalk’, then distorted it into a statement of fact about the present world, which I never made. Then you made a ridiculous and unjustified inference and finished off by making an illogical and baseless accusation.

          Clap clap clap…

          Guess what rhetorical device this is:

          “I’m REALLY impressed by your intelligence!!!”

          • Kathy
            May 14, 2012 at 8:29 pm #

            And I never said anything about the present world. You’re saying that Slutwalk forces men to deny their sexuality, which, if it were true, would mean that sluts couldn’t exist. Ergo, there would be no slutwalk.

            The only thing Slutwalk is trying to repress in men is the impulse to rape. According to you, Slutwalk is trying to repress men’s natural sexuality (or ‘sexually’ as stated in your original post, if you will begin talking piffle about intelligence). Therefore, what Slutwalk calls rape, you call sexuality.

            Can you see where I’m going with this?

            And once again, I’m being polite. There is no need to be rude.

            • May 14, 2012 at 8:42 pm #

              “And I never said anything about the present world.”

              But you said, “If women force men to repress their sexuality completely…how are there sluts in the first place?”

              That makes no sense.

              • Kathy
                May 14, 2012 at 9:06 pm #

                Right.

                You said that Slutwalk is about women forcing men to repress their sexuality for women’s comfort.
                I said that if that’s what Slutwalk is doing then there would never have been a Slutwalk to begin with.

                Because!

                Slutwalk is made up of women, who want to enjoy the right to dress how, and sleep with who, they choose.
                And if men repressed their sexuality, there would be nobody for us non-sapphic sisters to play with.

                Comprende so far? I’m sure you do.

                TO CONCLUDE!

                Slutwalk is about preventing rape and sexual assault, and preventing victim-blame in the devastating event of a rape or sexual assault. Chatting up a woman while being respectful towards her is neither of those things. It is not about repressing natural and healthy sexuality in anybody, including men.

      • Liz
        May 15, 2012 at 6:40 pm #

        Slutwalks are absolutely NOT about “a woman’s right to be a slut” they are about any human being’s right to wear the clothes they like without being RAPED. That is, an unwilling participant in a sexual act, something to which they HAVE NOT GIVEN CONSENT, which is illegal, hateful, traumatic, and a whole number of other really terrible things that are NEVER going to be the fault of the victim. Never. Nothing about what ANYONE wears is ANY indication that they have sex, that they have a lot of sex, that they have or have had multiple sexual partners, that they want to have sex with anyone, that they are more likely to have an STD or STI or be a part of “paternity fraud.” Your article and your comments are completely misogynistic, and you represent some of the worst things on the internet. (and I honestly don’t care that I’m posting this comment two months after this article. You deserve to be called out on your horrible, hateful attitudes toward women.)

        • May 15, 2012 at 7:09 pm #

          To start, I accept that rape is the fault of the perpertrator.

          That aside, a question for you.

          Given that we live in an imperfect world (where rapists exist), is it reasonable to suggest that a woman should take responsibility to manage the levels of risk they incur by the choice of venue and dress before deciding to go to an event?

          • Kathy
            May 15, 2012 at 8:00 pm #

            In an imperfect world, this is wise, but not a responsibility.

            By asking her to take responsibility for managing the risks of being in an imperfect world, you’re saying that the risks of being in an imperfect world are her responsibility to take.

            • May 16, 2012 at 2:18 pm #

              I have to be responsible for not walking down a dark alley with my laptop bag over my shoulder and my bling out, because this is an imperfect world (where robbers exist). If I am not responsible, I would be negligent in being irresponsible?

              If I, as a man, am negligent, is it fair to conclude that a woman is similarly negligent for not taking equivalent preventative measures?

              • Kathy
                May 31, 2012 at 9:22 pm #

                I agree that that’s a wise idea, but it’s not your responsibility. No crime is the responsibility of the victim. There are always steps that can be taken to prevent it, but if those steps will impact on your life-therefore letting yourself and youe behaviour be dictated by criminals-many people refuse to take them. I’m certainly not going to let a sexual predator make me feel that I should cover up to avoid his unwanted advances.

                There is nothing morally wrong with making your own choices, instead of letting a small number of rapists dictate what you wear.

                • Richard Lee
                  June 2, 2012 at 9:56 am #

                  There is an important distinction here that you are missing. The rapist is always at fault, they are basically monsters who do not have control of their inhibitions. They are acting irrationally; they should either be put down or rehabilitated. Wouldn’t you say not baiting such creatures is wise? You can aim to defy them, but defying is based on resisting something you can be reasoned with. Trying to reason with monsters is foolish, especially when they’re hungry and trying to eat you!

                  Let me put it to you this way. We are told to “be responsible” by not locking our valuables within plain sight in a carpark. Those signs in our carparks remind us of our responsibility to be wise, and there is no outcry. If someone breaks into your car, sure it is the robber’s fault, but he still broke into your car. Why is there no comparable anger at signs that say, “take responsibility for the valuables in your car?” Wouldn’t I be considered negligent for not hiding my valuables?

                  I would love women to dress provocatively. I want it to happen more often, and I want the police to protect women so they can do it more often.

                  Nevertheless, I am a realist. There are rapists we have no visibility of, we cannot control, and the police cannot be around 24/7, and they cannot be on every street corner at the same time. No amount of confected anger about the slutwalk will change the above fact… nobody can protect you 24/7. It’s up each women to be responsible for lowering her risk profile, because nobody else can. I can’t find every rapist and ask the beasts not to rape the women, they wouldn’t listen anyway. That’s something adult, something responsible and something wise to expect from each person in our society- to take responsibility for our choices, rather than to ask for someone to baby us. That’s why I take issue with slutwalk- by placing blame the marchers abjure the responsibilities of women.

                  So dress wise. Save the lingerie for the bedroom, or when you have your own security detail.

                  • Brady
                    October 22, 2012 at 5:42 pm #

                    Rape happens in cultures where women cover themselves head to toe. It is not a question of what you are wearing, it is a question of respect. Men who respect all woman as other equal human beings do not rape, because rape is not about sex; it is about power and entitlement.

                    When we teach women that what they wear is responsible for the heinous acts of another person we are taking blame off of the people who can actually prevent these problems. Rapists are the only people who can stop rape. By not raping people.

                    This might seem like a silly fantasy, but if you teach your kids that they are not entitled to another person’s body then chances are they will be less likely to try to force themselves on another person.

                    It will take time but the first thing to stop making it about the clothing choices of the people being aggressed upon.

          • January 21, 2013 at 10:42 pm #

            If we lived in a world where women were only raped while dressing sexy you might have an argument here but there is no correlation to how a woman is dressed and how likely she is to get raped. There is also the fact that women are more likely to be raped by someone they know, so this idea that if they stay out of bars and clubs and alleys and they’ll somehow be safe is illogical and completely misleading. Rape is not caused by dress. This is what the slut walk is about. But I mean, keep your head in the sand if it’s that important for you to white knight fucking rapists.

    • James Hill
      March 19, 2012 at 10:38 am #

      I agree with you that both genders need to take responsibility for their actions. From a practical standpoint, I think there’s less negativity placed on promiscuous men because of the way courtship traditionally occurs.

      Men are expected to pursue women and compete against other men for a woman’s affection. This means that men are expected to show interest and initiate flirting and physical intimacy. So men are seen to get away with more, because if one party doesn’t take a risk and escalate intimacy, nobody would ever date.

      There are drawbacks for men though: unwanted attention is considered creepy or degrading to women. I think this is the point Jason is trying to make: many men feel frustrated because society expects them to pursue women, but they’re advances are rebuffed and they’re accused of being creeps.

      There aren’t any easy answers, society has different expectations for different genders and there are drawbacks for both.

      • March 19, 2012 at 3:58 pm #

        James, may I hire you as my official spokesperson? You’re the rare person who says, “I think Jason means this,” and instead of me rolling my eyes I think, “Hell yeah!”

      • Kathy
        May 14, 2012 at 11:16 pm #

        Women who are rude to men who approach them politely are assholes.
        Men who won’t take a polite no for an answer are assholes.

        Sorted!

    • bresner23
      March 29, 2012 at 5:36 am #

      Here you go, idiot: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y5OdQGbVNa4

    • Anonymous
      August 6, 2012 at 8:23 am #

      But if a woman is getting impregnated by a man who is able to run off without leaving a proper phone number, wouldn’t that make them BOTH sluts, as she obviously didn’t know him before the sexual activity?

    • Verna
      January 19, 2013 at 7:46 am #

      Yes, he is saying men can’t be sluts. On the Dr Phil show he said he knows women are sluts because more than one of his friends slept with them. He had no bad words for the guys, only the women.

  3. March 19, 2012 at 12:37 am #

    Hey Jason, my main obstacle to agreeing with the advice of the original Toronto cop, or rather, the whole “slut shaming” issue, is that, like opinion, one person’s definition of what dressing like a Slut is, is completely different to another person’s. That makes the entire issue (both sides!!) fall down.

    For example: We go out to a bar one night, teeming with sexually attractive girls wearing figure hugging dresses and batting gorgeous lashes framing eyes applied with a hint of smoky make-up. I would call that classy, sassy, quite normal and very much acceptable appearance for girls of any age. Others out there, would call it slutty, particularly older generations who think that whores are the ones who wear bikinis and get their bellybuttons pierced, or fathers of the daughters in question who know what men are like.

    Men secretly look at women all the time with sexual thoughts somewhere on their mind. This is particularly increased when the girls are in groups. It’s normal, how men operate. This male behavior occurs regardless of whether the girl is dressed in a fishnet dress with a g-banger visible at the sides, or a pencil skirt and fitted shirt. Men are men, and objectifying women has nothing to do with how the girl dresses, as long as she looks attractive, it’s on. It also proves that rape has nothing to do with how a girl dresses. Sickos are sickos, no matter what. To be “baiting the wolf” for these sickos, all you need to do is have a vagina and not look like Beth Ditto. (haha).

    So while I think that Slutwalk was a ridiculous movement of empowerment by attempting to “claim back the term slut”, I also think that what the Toronto cop said is invalid — and just like he can use free speech to say it, the women (and men) of the world with more sense, can use theirs to tell him how narrow-minded that statement was.

    • March 19, 2012 at 7:04 am #

      I’m amused that you wrote “men secretly look at women,” because it tells you something very important: male sexuality is shameful in our society. Just looking at a scantily clad woman is considered creepy and predatory but what the fuck are men meant to do? We’re heterosexual men, we look at women’s bodies and it makes us horny. It doesn’t make us dangerous, it doesn’t make us less human than women and we shouldn’t feel ashamed of it.

      But what happens if men stop feeling ashamed about just start looking at women? What if men just do what comes naturally and stare at scantily clad women boldly? After the initial shit storm had passed I think many women would shy away from wearing such revealing clothing, but women being women, they’d still find clothes we’d think are sassy and classy to wear. A large part of the slut factor is that women get their sense of social power from how other people see them: hence the make-up, clothing obsessions, tea-parties and flaunting their bodies in public far more often than men or boys do. Dressing like a slut, but still being free to tell me to feel ashamed for looking at their exposed flesh is extremely empowering for women, at least it makes the feel powerful to feel desirable yet completely in control to check any unwanted attention they bring to themselves. Yet this feeling of being powerful seldom translates into any useful power to make themselves happier.

      But as I said, if men didn’t feel ashamed staring at exposed cleavage the slut’s sense of feeling in control of the situation will quickly vanish and she’ll cover up fast. Try it next time you’re on a train and a women is revealing most of her breasts, she loves it until she can’t control people’s reactions to it. And don’t feel ashamed to look, she chose to make her body public after all.

      • March 19, 2012 at 10:22 am #

        That’s a separate issue though. Regardless of whether men can or can’t ogle girls openly still doesn’t change the point that “dressing like a slut” is completely subjective to different men and women. The last thing I, as a normal heterosexual guy, want, is for girls to feel as though they shouldn’t go out to clubs and bars dressing like / made up like they currently do (which is more than appropriate levels of dress in my view) just because there are some prudes in the world who would call that “slutty”. You can’t put a measurable threshold on “slutty” just like you can’t put a measurable threshold on the word “offensive”.

      • bresner23
        March 29, 2012 at 5:37 am #

        Men finally have permission to be men: http://goo.gl/obiC

      • Kathy
        May 31, 2012 at 9:24 pm #

        You’ve pretty much entirely missed his point, there.

      • Kathy
        May 31, 2012 at 9:27 pm #

        In fact, you’ve taken a tiny fraction of his post and turned it into a suggestion that men actively TRY to use sexual attention as a weapon to make women feel ashamed. Nice one.

      • Verna
        January 19, 2013 at 7:48 am #

        Oh, so that’s your problem with so called “sluts?” They cover up when they see you wetting yourself? Sounds like an issue a guy like you would have.

    • James Hill
      March 19, 2012 at 10:28 am #

      I actually think it matters less what women wear and more how they behave. Getting blackout drunk, or getting separated from your friends and drinking with strangers are far more dangerous than dressing provocatively, at least in most western countries. Men place themselves at risk with this sort of behaviour too, they’re just less likely to be sexually assaulted and more likely to be attacked and/or robbed.

      • March 19, 2012 at 1:34 pm #

        Would it be accurate to say that, due to behaviour, more guys get into violent assaults every week in the city than girls get sexually assaulted?

        • April 4, 2012 at 9:12 am #

          Definitely, however, we don’t warn men about this, we only warn women. Why don’t we care about the safety of men?

          • May 14, 2012 at 4:16 pm #

            Who do you think is doing the warning? Is it women warning other women against dressing like ‘sluts’, as you say? Because from where I’m standing, there’s an awful lot of paternalistic advice being spouted from males on this page alone. If you really care so much about protecting men from violence on the street, why don’t you focus your efforts on that rather than writing ridiculously offensive rubbish about how all women need to protect themselves from wolves?

            Despite the fact that, as you correctly put it, the majority of men are very capable of not sexually assaulting women, and indeed find the idea abhorrent, you are still very keen to suggest women live in fear of being branded a slut – which is an entirely subjective idea, and one that has absolutely no place in a civilised society.

            Advising women against ‘dressing like sluts’ (which Andrew Beato points out is all dependent upon who’s doing the name calling) so that they can avoid sexual assaults they are then apparently responsible for is exactly the same as me telling all of you not to go out drinking with your mates, because statistics show that male-on-male violence increases when alcohol is present. But you don’t see anyone saying that.

            Perhaps Jason, the reason society doesn’t warn men about violence on the street is because, based on the way we like to advice people to ‘protect’ themselves, that would involve advising men to limit their activity and behaviour in some way – and we reserve that kind of judgment for women.*

            *Before anyone says men’s natural instincts are judged every day, consider this – if a lot of you are really laboring under the idea that your sexual instincts are being oppressed, then I’d suggest you take a good look at what it is you think you’re entitled to.

            • May 20, 2012 at 4:21 pm #

              “Because from where I’m standing, there’s an awful lot of paternalistic advice being spouted from males on this page alone.”

              I’ve got at least two female friends on here offering maternal advice as well.

              “the majority of men are very capable of not sexually assaulting women”

              Why do you even bother trying to hide the fact that you hate men? Just come out at say it like a person who has the courage of her convictions.

              “statistics show that male-on-male violence increases when alcohol is present”

              Next you’re going to tell me this doesn’t happen to women or when women are involved with two different men at once.

              I know perfectly well why society protects women, it’s because society views women as eternal children who need to be cared and looked after like children for the entirety of their lives. Personally, I just can’t understand women who buy into this. Surely you don’t want to just be given houses, given money, given positions of power? Wouldn’t you prefer to earn these things like a man and be proud of your own achievements? Because all this affirmative action just because you’re a woman is going to get rather unfulfiling one day.

              • Kathy
                May 31, 2012 at 9:32 pm #

                ‘Why do you even bother trying to hide the fact that you hate men?’

                I fail to see anything whatsoever in her posts that suggests a hatred of men in general.

    • April 17, 2012 at 1:31 am #

      Yeah, slutty dressing is in the eye of the beholder but if something is figure hugging a girl is still more likely to be drawing the male gaze than the girl wearing the mumu.

      It’s easier to say that fashion has evolved as the need females have for attention has risen. Therefore, it’s considered normal and not slutty. I mean, a hundred years ago or so it was considered slutty to be flashing your ankles.

      Besides, I can say that yes. Yes, I totally dressed inappropriately when I was younger and it was 100% for the attention. How do I know it was inappropriate? Well, when a cop pulls over and wants to know if you and your friend are hookers, you know. Now that I dress like someone who gives a shit about herself…what do you know, the attention I actually notice isn’t leering and destructive. As a recovered slutty dresser I can say that this slut problem totally exists. I admit that the bad attention was not my intention but it happened almost directly as a result of how I was putting myself out there.

      I don’t think his statement was narrow-minded. I think he was concerned about a genuine problem with definite risk factors!

      • April 19, 2012 at 8:29 pm #

        “Now that I dress like someone who gives a shit about herself”

        Self-respect. If I ever have kids I’m going to drill into them a healthy addiction to self-respect. All this self-esteem rubbish, it promotes this idea that one locus of control is outside of oneself, when it is inside oneself. Self-respect teaches a person to take control of their life and make the most of it. Love your writing Tamiko!

      • Kathy
        May 15, 2012 at 9:18 pm #

        Of course you’ll get attention when you dress in revealing clothes, but that doesn’t mean that a guy has a right to keep harassing you after you’ve said no. That applies no matter what you’re wearing.

        But seeing as you’re such an expert, why don’t you go ahead and define what a ‘slutty’ outfit is?

        • May 20, 2012 at 5:23 pm #

          “but that doesn’t mean that a guy has a right to keep harassing you after you’ve said no”

          I don’t think anyone has suggested otherwise.

          “But seeing as you’re such an expert, why don’t you go ahead and define what a ‘slutty’ outfit is?”

          For the millionth time, sluttiness is a behaviour, not a style of dress. Sure, one can spot a slut by her clothing most of the time, but only with a benefit of considerable hindsight and intracultural experience.

          • Kathy
            May 24, 2012 at 8:55 pm #

            ‘it’s like advertising ice water in the summer and being surprised when someone takes you up on it. Or advertising it, then insisting they can’t have any, and being surprised when they take it.’

            -The author

            Pretty sure that is suggesting otherwise.

            And this girl is specifically talking about slutty dressing, so that’s what I’m questioning her on.

  4. heratyck
    March 19, 2012 at 6:37 am #

    As I see it, the problem with the slutwalk movement is not that it empowers or encourages women to be sluts, but rather that it attempts to advocate a kind of “counterphobic” approach to handling women’s fears regarding men, their own sexuality, and how it’s perceived by others. The original intent may have been to call attention to the issue of rape and women’s safety, but it’s gone beyond that. Now it seems that it’s main purpose is to validate all the young women who’ve felt offended/violated/marginalized because they’ve been negatively judged or received “unwanted” attention for dressing and/or acting in sexually provocative ways. And the reason that this is problematic is because it’s a completely unrealistic attitude. The fact is, we all draw conclusions about a person based on visual cues that we receive from them. We look for signs that someone is friendly or a threat and, (just like other animals) we also look for cues that signal that someone wants to mate. Sometimes the conclusions we’ve drawn are right, and sometimes they’re not. Either way though, it’s not going to change because it’s just a part of how we have evolved as a species. So the idea that women have the right to dress in a sexual way without being perceived as such, would require us to change a half a million years of evolution.

    Yes, as a society we still have our hangups about sex, and yes, a lot of those hangups revolve around women specifically. It’s unfortunate, but it’s not without hope. We have made a lot of progress over the years, and continue to do so. But I don’t think that counterphobically trying to embrace/reclaim/own derogative terms (and the stereotypes associated with them) is the way to change anything. There needs to be less focus on “men” as the problem, and more of a focus on encouraging responsibility for ones self esteem and teaching young women how to develop good strong boundaries, and that it’s okay to enforce them. If women have confidence in themselves and feel secure with their sexuality, then being hit on or being misperceived as a “slut” really isn’t that big of an issue, because you know that you’re capable of enforcing your boundaries and that your character is not defined by what other people think of you.

    • April 4, 2012 at 9:22 am #

      Here here!

      If I could just add to this, I think women are more fearful of their safety than men are in general. I believe men pick up on this instinctively and try to reassure women they are safe, however, when men do this and it is coupled with the negative stereotype of men being sexual predators by design it actually makes women more suspicious, distrusting and fearful of men and provokes them into being angry at men. Even though the vast majority of men instinctively want to protect women.

      Personally, any woman who doesn’t appreciate the typical man’s desire to protect her for no other reason than because she’s a woman, doesn’t deserve the protection of any man. Especially if she abuses this desire to men to enact proxy violence through him. I think men are just as culpable as women though in this equation. Far too many men worship the ground women walk on and accept their shit tests as normal female behaviour.

      • Kathy
        May 31, 2012 at 10:09 pm #

        ‘Personally, any woman who doesn’t appreciate the typical man’s desire to protect her for no other reason than because she’s a woman, doesn’t deserve the protection of any man.’

        So a man’s ‘protection’ should be APPRECIATED whether it was asked for or not, but women who EXPECT it are ‘eternal children who need to be cared and looked after like children for the entirety of their lives’ and you ‘just can’t understand women who buy into this’?

  5. Meg
    April 12, 2012 at 3:02 pm #

    Oh my god I hope I never meet any of you in real life.

    You think male sexuality is shameful? Don’t make me laugh. A guy who sleeps with multiple girls is a player, a pimp. He gets high-fives. He’s doing only what’s “natural.” A girl who sleeps with multiple guys is a slut. She has destroyed her virginity – her purity.

    YOU don’t think this way? GREAT, but it’s not hard to see that the majority of society thinks this way.

    • April 12, 2012 at 4:56 pm #

      “Oh my god I hope I never meet any of you in real life.”

      Why? Is it some kind of great honour? Or will you run away crying from the big bad scary men?

      Can you, with your extensive experience as a woman, tell me more about what it’s like being a man? I’m really interested to know.

      Onto your BS: A guy who sleeps with multiple women is a sleaze. The only men who will hold him up are sleazely men. You are looking at the behaviour of a small number of men and generalising it across to all men, then using it as justication for women to commit acts with are indecent. It’s like saying, “Thieves rob shops, but some of them can get away, I should be allowed the privilege to rob shops too, but not suffer the consequences like they do because some thieves get away with their crimes!” This is the philosophy of a con artist not of a responsible adult.

      If you sleep around with multiple men, I’m going to think you’re a slut and I’m going to have a bad opinion of your character. I don’t care if other people think differently to me, or if I’m in the minority, which I suspect I’m not incidentally, that’s just my opinion and I live by it.

      She didn’t destroy her purity, she destroyed her reputation as an honourable person, that was her choice, and that’s the consequences she faces. Boys face the same problem when they are irresponsible, they get a bad reputation for being irresponsible and it creates consequences for them too. This is equality, real equality for the sexes.

      • Kathy
        May 14, 2012 at 8:13 pm #

        Out of curiosity, why would you judge a woman (or man) unfavourably purely because they sleep around, if they take all precautions to remain emotionally and physically healthy and to promote the same for those they sexually engage with? I would say that that’s very honourable.

        • May 14, 2012 at 8:22 pm #

          Oh, if they did that, then sure.

          Just one problem. I’ve never, ever seen a single example of this in my life, not have I ever heard of such a thing happening. But I’m sure it does happen… somewhere over the rainbow.

          I’m sorry, this is not a realistic scenario, this is Alice in Wonderland. 1 in 4 American women did not get STDs deliberately.

          Some advice, give up on the daydreams and focus on what works.

          • Kathy
            May 14, 2012 at 8:36 pm #

            I do this, to the best of my ability, as do many people that I know and people that they know. Polyamory is another example when done right.

            This is what we should be aiming for. Accepting things you know are wrong instead of pushing for ‘daydreams’ to come true would nullify the vast majority of human achievements.

            • Lizzy
              March 11, 2013 at 10:22 am #

              This is also exactly how I conduct my sex life, safely and happily.

          • Bec
            May 16, 2012 at 12:14 pm #

            Just because everybody you know/have met is an idiot and can’t use protection (or be responsible enough to get checked out and abstain from sex if they have an STI) doesn’t mean it never happens
            & using the same statistic; that 3 in 4 american women do not have STIs would indicate that the majority of women are practicing safe sex.

      • Verna
        January 19, 2013 at 7:53 am #

        Really, Jason? What consequence do men face?

        Do you know what it’s like to be a woman? You challenge a woman here to say what it’s like to be a man. Why don’t you tell me what it’s like to be a woman?

        By the way, even if you’re in the majority it doesn’t make it right and you are just passing on your poor judgments to another generation.

        I personally, after seeing you on Phil, think you are just lashing out at women because they won’t have anything to do with you.

      • Lavabreix
        October 20, 2015 at 11:36 pm #

        I agree. A classy man would not fuck und dumb a slut. He doesnt need to be with many sluts, he has class. My boyfriend had sex with only one slut before he was with me. He regrets it and he didnt do it again because he is disgusted by those easy women.

        You can have much sex in a relationship or at least with someone you know. Because people who first get to know a person usually are more responsible!!!

        A slut is a woman who sleeps with more than 2 men in a year. 1-2 men in a year are OK, but its even better if a woman hasnt more than 7 men in her entire life.
        Men shouldnt have more than 10 women in their life. Yes I am making little differences between men and women, but that isnt sexist, its because some men need a lady in their life before they realize how stupid it is to fuck random sluts.

        SORRY FOR MY ENGLISH!! Im from russia.

        The dress; Women you can show your legs OR cleavage. Not all at the same time. You dont need to show it all off, because it doesnt look good. Slutty is NOT sexy, slutty is tasteless. Sexy is tastefull.

        No one is calling women ”heyy fucking slut!!” on the street. They just think of her negatively and avoid being friends with her. Of course there are cases where people bullied a woman for being a slut (or even if she wasnt a real slut). That’s sad but its not that common. Mostly people just ignore sluts.

        Yes I am slut-shamer. But I only call REAL sluts, sluts.

    • AlekNovy
      April 16, 2012 at 12:57 am #

      You think male sexuality is shameful? Don’t make me laugh. A guy who sleeps with multiple girls is a player, a pimp. He gets high-fives. He’s doing only what’s “natural.” A girl who sleeps with multiple guys is a slut. She has destroyed her virginity – her purity.

      Meg, I love your fantasy world! Where is it located?!? I would like to move there.

      Getting high-fives for sleeping around? SIGN ME UP!!

      I actually know plenty of men who are known for racking up many partners. They have to deal with hostility, creep-shaming, sleaze-shaming, being called perverts or even “abusers of wemen” and even sometimes called “evil” for the mere act of not being monogamous.

      Seriously Meg, please leave the house. Forming opinions on what the world is like based on your insecure fantasies and reading feminist blogs is not healthy. Leave the house once in a while Meg.

      • Kathy
        May 14, 2012 at 8:16 pm #

        That is appalling-calling a man an abuser of women for engaging in healthy consentual sex is a massive blow to all those who really have been abused.

        • May 14, 2012 at 8:26 pm #

          Strangely, men find the idea of one man running around impregnating hundreds of women only to have other men raise those children for him very distasteful. Men sleaze shame too, and rightly so.

          • Kathy
            May 14, 2012 at 9:12 pm #

            If someone is intentionally going to hurt someone, then yes, shame away. Otherwise, don’t. Surely that makes sense?

          • Lo
            May 16, 2012 at 2:52 am #

            Because women don’t raise and pay for their mutual children…?

      • Lavabreix
        October 20, 2015 at 11:56 pm #

        Many women wont date those ”slutty” men. Of course the shaming of women is much worse, but men get shamed too. So we arent thet unequal in society, actually…

        I personally dont shame men who sleep around. I just avoid them.

        ALSO I never heard ANYONE saying that a woman needs to stay virgin until marriage, lmao what are these feminists even talking about?

    • April 17, 2012 at 1:38 am #

      Meg, you want to know why it’s frowned upon when women sleep with multiple partners? Ever hear of paternity fraud?

      When a man sleeps around he’s not questioning who the mother of ‘his’ child is. When a woman sleeps around she’s totally going to be wondering who the father of her child is. It’s reallly as simple as that. And it’s as serious as it is because if a man has a child with a woman and only wants that one child if she’s lied to him then his genetic line ENDS.

      • April 17, 2012 at 1:31 pm #

        Tamiko, I’m afraid to say this, but I’m impressed with your empathy for men. Most women never comprehend this thing, or downplay its importance and as a result never understand how men actually feel. Men will move heaven and Earth to protect children they know are their own, they will even endure a sexless and loveless marriage for their kids. The care and love the human male demonstrates for their children is truly impressive. However, even in men who suspect their children aren’t theirs will remain distant and detached from raising them. Knowing a woman is honourable means a lot to a man, I cannot stress that enough. 30% of children born in the lowest socio-economic bracket of the UK are not the children of the father on the birth certificate, compare this to only 4% on the other end of the spectrum. Paternal certainty dramatically improves a family’s well being because the man is passionately committed to the well-being of that family.

        If you meet a man who doesn’t care if a woman is honourable or not, stay away from him. But if you want that kind of man, dress like a slut because you’ll attract them all.

        • April 17, 2012 at 2:35 pm #

          Exactly! Can’t tell you how many girls I’ve known that just don’t get this. When you make yourself out to be trash you attract the flies!

          Of course, I have to admit that I wasn’t always empathetic towards men. My mother has strong femininist tendencies. I was raised with that skewed view, especially after she managed to chase my father off. When I moved away from my mother it started getting worse before it got better. The dogma she’d instilled had been steadily ruining my life. I thought the only common factor is ME…so let’s ponder why. Eventually, I was able to see the illogical way women live and shift blame.

          What saddens me the most about mens’ rights movement is that men aren’t even allowed to defend themselves without being called sexist pigs. Few women seem willing to step up and say something. I don’t know if it’s because they’re content as long as they’re being treated as the more equal animal or just plain evil.

          I personally think that paternity fraud should be charged as seriously as murder. It’s precisely what it is.

          • April 19, 2012 at 8:36 pm #

            Paternity fraud is just one aspect of it.

            We live in societies where rape is considered a more serious crime than forcibly amputating a father from his children for life. It is sick. Don’t get me wrong, rape is a terrible crime, but if someone kidnapped your children and financially destroyed you would you give fuck about being raped on top of that?

            GirlWritesWhat released another video today about female hypoagency and discussed how men had been effectively selectively bred to be obedient to the needs of women. It was a real eye-opener. So many men instinctively come to aid of women without invitation or thinking about what they’re doing.

            • Kathy
              May 14, 2012 at 11:25 pm #

              Yes. I would absolutely give a fuck about being raped.

        • Kathy
          May 14, 2012 at 8:20 pm #

          Why is ‘honour’ exclusive to sexual abstinence?

          • May 14, 2012 at 8:28 pm #

            It isn’t. Honour applies to every human relationship. One can deceive oneself for example, that is literally dishonouring oneself.

            • Kathy
              May 14, 2012 at 8:40 pm #

              So if one is honest with oneself and their partners about their sexual intentions, you would call any of those pairings (or threesomes, or foursomes) honourable?

            • Verna
              January 19, 2013 at 8:06 am #

              You would know, Jason. You’ve convinced yourself that what you are saying here is useful in any manner.

        • Kathy
          May 15, 2012 at 9:22 pm #

          So as long as a woman only sleeps with one man a month, it’s okay to dress and act however she wants otherwise?

      • Lavabreix
        October 20, 2015 at 11:40 pm #

        Men who sleep around as just as bad in my opinion. Its not solely because of the children. Its just bad behavior…in my opinion.

        Women shouldnt have sex with more than 2 men in a year and they need to wait at least 3 months if they want to have a new partner, because of paternity fraud.

  6. Anonymous
    April 12, 2012 at 6:19 pm #

    Jason, have you considered the destructive & irresponsible behaviour of Slutty Men?

    • April 12, 2012 at 6:53 pm #

      1. Have you read my article? Or just skimmed over it?
      2. Have men or men’s groups organised Sleazewalks?
      3. Have men demanded the right to act like a slut? Ever?
      4. Do men have a reputation of carrying on like children when someone offers them some safety advice?

      • January 21, 2013 at 11:10 pm #

        1. Yes, and it exclusively focused on women and overlooked male responsibility.
        2. Men don’t need to organize “sleazewalks” because men aren’t vilified for the amount of sex they have, And just be aware that being vilified for being a liar, cheater, or a manipulator, when these things are called out, is not the same as being vilified for simply choosing to be non-monogamous or having sex with people you’re not committed to as long as you’re honest, consensual, and using protection.
        3. Men don’t need to demand the right to act like sluts because they are not called sluts for being promiscuous.
        4. Some men, namely dipshits like you and other MRAs, have a reputation of carrying on like children when someone asks that you just have the decency to respect other people’s bodies and boundaries and control your urges to rape, molest, assault, and harass women. I think it’s a lot more valid to be upset that people ask you to hold yourself responsible for making sure someone else doesn’t make the decision to hurt you (especially when your “advice” has no bearing on the reality of whether or not they will actually get raped seeing as how there is no correlation between dressing sexy and being raped) than to be upset by the notion that you should be held accountable for your choice to hurt someone else.

        • AlekNovy
          October 24, 2015 at 1:21 pm #

          “2. Men don’t need to organize “sleazewalks” because men aren’t vilified for the amount of sex they have”

          When you say “men” you really mean the top 0.1% of men, because the rest of us are just stupid losers, not actual humans, right?

          Only the top 0.1% men get to have high-quantities of easy sex (which is only possible through skiping courtship, and going for “quick lays”)

          The other 99.9% of men either:

          A) Get called creeps, shamed and ridiculed whenever they attempt “quick sex”, so they give up on the idea of quick sex… and succumb to long-courtship and never get to have any casual sex. They date 2-3 girls in their lifetime through months of courtship for each, marrying the 3rd or 4th one they ever have… This describes most of the male population.

          or

          B) There’s a small group of not-super-duper-attractive and 0.1% charisma guys who do have non-monogamous sex. These guys do it by battling through all the shaming and pure persistence and massive rejection. They are called sleazebags.

          When a top 0.1% man attempts quick sex, he’s “bold”. When a less than most-attractive man attempts it, he’s a creep. When a not-super-attractive man attempts 20-30 times to get the one girl who won’t call him a creep for suggesting quick sex… he will then be called a sleazebag…

          So there’s that.

  7. Anonymous
    April 12, 2012 at 8:58 pm #

    This article is disgusting. “If a woman dresses like a slut, teases drunk and sexually frustrated men in a shady bar late at night, it doesn’t make the rape/sexual assault ok, but it does tell me that that woman is a stupid irresponsible twit, and honestly, I have has much sympathy for her as those soccer fans: nil.”

    The way you dress, act or where you go does not mean you should even have to CONSIDER someone raping you, that’s the point. You should be able to do whatever the fuck you want without being concerned about rape. Making women change what they’re doing is just oppressive, you should be making men stop fucking raping just because a woman is showing some skin. I am absolutely appalled that you say you have ‘nil’ sympathy for a woman who is raped. Fuck you, I was raped, and I definitely didn’t deserve it but you might argue ‘my shirt was tight’ so it’s fine and I should’ve expected it.

    • April 12, 2012 at 9:39 pm #

      “You should be able to do whatever the fuck you want without being concerned about rape.”

      lol… yes, life should be a magical wonderful fantasy world where nobody gets hurt, grows old or dies. I hope you’re just trolling me.

      You were raped? Apart from the fact no one here needs to know this, that’s an awfully personal thing to be sharing with the rest of the world. So why are you telling us when nobody here cares to know about it?

      Finally, your accusation that I would think that rape was “deserved” is a dishonest manipulation of what I actually wrote. Point to the line where I say rape is deserved.

      • May 14, 2012 at 4:19 pm #

        I see. So you’re allowed to freely discuss what you think women might be doing to ignore the realities of rape and sexual assault, but someone who’s actually experienced it is oversharing.

        Perhaps if you actually took the time to listen to the victims of sexual assault rather than just offering them advice, you might actually get some context to your argument. Skirts don’t invite rape, but an awful lot of people seem to use them as an excuse not to support the victims of it.

      • May 15, 2012 at 1:10 am #

        If nobody cares about it, why were there all these protests all over the world, which annoyed you enough to write a long opinion piece and then maintain a comment roll the length of War and Piece?

      • Kathy
        May 15, 2012 at 9:31 pm #

        Rape is a worldwide issue, and we do care to hear from those who’ve been raped. She should be proud of the strength to talk about it when for years women who’ve been raped have, yes, been shamed into silence, or made to feel like being able to talk about it means it wasn’t as bad as they claim it was. Otherwise why would you want to re-live such a memory?

        Talking about it means she’s not ashamed. Why wouldn’t she share it with the rest of the world?

      • January 21, 2013 at 11:23 pm #

        Finally an honest statement from you. It’s obvious you don’t care to know about someone’s actual lived experience with rape. it’s much easier for you to pretend you know about it. It’s much easier to pretend you know the cause. It’s much easier to not do the research that would show you that you’re being an absolutely disgusting, misogynist, rape apologist, asshole when you write this kind of shit. Being confronted with the cases of rape that contradict your ignorant, limited world view that only women who whore around and dress like sluts, ie: women who deserve it, might make you have to face reality. That’s way too hard for someone like you who wants to play the victim (the thing you accuse so many women of when in reality you’re just projecting) when you have never been the victim. Here an actual victim is explaining to you why you’re full of shit and all you can do is tell her you don’t care?

        Well how about stop discussing something that you don’t care to understand? Stop pretending to be the authority on a subject when you won’t even sit down and listen to an actual victim? You truly are a cyber bully and a coward, and you showed your true colors on the Dr Phil show. It’s so easy to act like a smug, self-satisfied douche when nobody can call you out to your face, but the second people questioned you you had nothing to say. So embarrassing.

        • Anonymous
          September 17, 2014 at 8:59 pm #

          I know this is a really late reply, but I just have to say, Jessay, you hit the nail right on the head. You’ve described EXACTLY what I was thinking. Talk about ultimate hypocrisy. Jason is just subhuman, lacking in the most basic elements of human empathy. If I were his mother I’d be mortified to have a son like him. Telling a rape victim that their experience is personal and no one cares to hear it (which is not true, btw) is not even an argument. They’re just empty words written by an air-head.

    • heratyck
      April 24, 2012 at 3:59 am #

      “You should be able to do whatever the fuck you want without being concerned about rape. Making women change what they’re doing is just oppressive, you should be making men stop fucking raping just because a woman is showing some skin.”

      Hell yeah, we should all be able to do whatever the fuck we want! Screw being responsible for own safety! And while we’re at it, we shouldn’t have to lock our doors or avoid crime ridden areas… It’s so “oppressive” to have to look out for ourselves when criminals should just stop breaking the law. Maybe they’ll stop if we ask them nicely?

      • Anonymous
        April 26, 2012 at 2:35 pm #

        lol@heratyck… sarcasm is win

      • Kathy
        May 4, 2012 at 1:06 am #

        In an ideal world, yes. And who isn’t striving for an ideal world?

        • heratyck
          May 4, 2012 at 9:33 am #

          Nothing wrong in striving to make things better, so long as you are aware of and accept the way things are currently.

          • Kathy
            May 14, 2012 at 9:10 pm #

            I’m aware of it-but I won’t accept it, because it’s wrong. Why would I accept something that’s wrong? That would be silly.

            • heratyck
              May 14, 2012 at 11:29 pm #

              You are confusing “accept” with “condone”. We live in a world that’s full of harsh realities. We may not like it, and we might even try and to change it, but to not accept the current reality for what it is would make one foolish and naive.

              • Kathy
                May 14, 2012 at 11:42 pm #

                ac•cept
                verb (used with object)
                1. To take or receive (something offered); receive with approval or favor: to accept a present; to accept a proposal.
                2. TO AGREE OR CONSENT TO; accede to: to accept a treaty; to accept an apology.
                3. To respond or answer affirmatively to: to accept an invitation.
                4. To undertake the responsibility, duties, honors, etc., of: to accept the office of president.

                I am aware of the difference between ‘accept’ and ‘condone’. I am aware of current reality. But no, I do not accept it. Acceptance means to do nothing; to consent, however tacitly. Nobody accepts rape-that’s why there are laws against it, and why there are no laws dictating how a woman should dress.

                • heratyck
                  May 15, 2012 at 12:50 am #

                  Surely you realize that the term “accept” may also mean something other than what you’ve listed…

                  Accept- To regard (something) as true or real: believe. To perceive and recognize the meaning of: apprehend, catch (on), compass, comprehend, conceive, fathom, follow, get, grasp, make out, read, see, sense, take, take in, understand. Informal: savvy. Slang: dig.

                  • Kathy
                    May 15, 2012 at 1:45 am #

                    So you think saying ‘I accept that’ and ‘I recognise that’ mean the same thing?

                    Okay, I’ll work with recognise from now on. Back in context, I recognise the current reality, but do not accept it. Neither do a lot of others. Hence the Slutwalk.

                    Interestingly, I think the two opposing sides of Slutwalk (for/against) could be summed up in the past six paragraphs of this exchange.

                    • heratyck
                      May 15, 2012 at 10:06 pm #

                      “So you think saying ‘I accept that’ and ‘I recognise that’ mean the same thing?”

                      That’s how I was meaning it more or less. To comprehend something fully…

      • January 21, 2013 at 11:28 pm #

        I left my doors unlocked for years. Used to leave my keys in my car unlocked overnight. I was only robbed after I started locking my doors. Someone who wants to commit a crime bad enough will find a way. All you’re doing by telling someone to “lock their doors” is telling them to make sure that the burglar robs someone else… same goes for telling a woman not to act/dress a certain way to avoid getting raped.

        • January 27, 2013 at 7:30 am #

          “Someone who wants to commit a crime bad enough will find a way.”

          That is true. However, most criminals are opportunists in search of the easy target… They’re looking for maximum payoff with minimal risk of getting caught. The more risk that’s involved, the less attractive the target is. A locked door means an increased risk of a would-be intruder getting caught because (if it’s a decent dead bolt) it means they’ll have to make some noise in order to break in… Posting signs that you have an alarm system or a dog on the premises increases that risk even further. Such measures are not meant to prevent someone from breaking in though, they are meant to act as deterrent.

          ” All you’re doing by telling someone to “lock their doors” is telling them to make sure that the burglar robs someone else… same goes for telling a woman not to act/dress a certain way to avoid getting raped.”

          So you’re saying that people should not try to deter criminals from targeting them because they’re essentially ensuring that the criminals will just go and target someone else? I’m sorry, but how is that my problem? Should I leave my doors wide open, post a “rob me” sign and sacrifice my own safety by making myself an attractive target just so that criminals wont go and target someone else?

        • Lavabreix
          October 20, 2015 at 11:47 pm #

          B***tch why are you even comparing your body with a lock? If a male gets murdered we dont compare his body with a lock.

    • Anonymous
      August 6, 2012 at 8:34 am #

      Do you also get offended if someone advises you not to go walking alone at night? If someone suggested that, would you say that they are implying anyone murdered while walking alone at night deserved it?

  8. April 13, 2012 at 6:48 am #

    It’s not a dishonest manipulation. It’s exactly what you wrote, the part quoted by that anonymous shows that well. It’s just that after you wrote it you said something like ‘not that I think it’s okay’ in some cowardly attempt to avoid criticism for it. But it’s clear what your thought process is, sluts deserve to be raped. After all, if she didn’t deserve it, why no sympathy? Well, because you felt she deserved it. Do you not see how much of a rape enabler you are?

    You’re the reason why women think you’re a sexual predator. Because you fucking sound like one and justify it to yourself by putting all the responsibility of rapist’s actions on the sluts that supposedly made them do it. There’s nothing controversial about your site, you’re saying the same hateful shit that’s been passed around for ages. Good luck!

    • April 13, 2012 at 8:27 am #

      Lilith, you’ve just done the same thing. Ignored or misunderstood what I wrote and jumped to some ludicrous conclusion because it’s what you want to believe.

      Some perspective on men: while a small proportion of men rape (but some women also rape), it isn’t women who stop rape, men do. For every man who rapes there are 50 men from policemen, to judges, to guards, to husbands, to ordinary everyday men on the street who step in to prevent, stop or punish rape. Women do fuck all by comparison to protect themselves.

      Yet, instead of generalising men as women’s protectors, you generalise men as rapists. Instead of seeing men and women having a mutualistic symbiotic relationship, you see men as parasites. You’re a hate monger against men, not an enlightened paragon of virtue.

      • Katya
        May 14, 2012 at 5:46 pm #

        I had to read this twice. Firstly, you’re suggesting there are no women in the police force, legal system, government, or working within rape prevention/awareness organisations. That women are the ‘raped’ and men are the ‘protectors of the raped’. Well, that’s one of the stupidest things anybody has said in this entire comment thread (which is saying something).

        So who are the rapists? “A small proportion of men” you say.
        And so the premise of your argument is that women should be held responsible for the actions of this “small proportion of men.”

        Not all women who are raped are “good looking”, wear sexy clothes, or are out drinking Cosmopolitans in NYC. If you do ever look at a page of rape statistics (perhaps a good idea next time you decide to pen an article like this) you would see that a many instances of rape occur within a woman’s circle of friends, often in lower socio-economic areas, and more often than you would guess within a relationship or in a dating situation.

        Somebody above said that a rapist only needs a woman to be in possession of a vagina and for her to not look like Beth Ditto. I would argue that oftentimes you could probably scrap the Beth Ditto clause…these guys are not picky. And they are not your average men – which I totally get.

        Unfortunately, articles like yours do nothing to further the cause of “men who do not want to be stereotyped as rapists” because what you are doing here is empathising with and justifying violent, life-destroying, criminal activity.

        • Kathy
          May 14, 2012 at 9:20 pm #

          This is probably the best reply I’ve seen so far. Nice one.

      • Cierra
        June 8, 2012 at 2:06 pm #

        Just want to point out that women can also be policemen, judges, guards, wife’s, to ordinary people who step in to prevent, stop or punish rape. Women help too in these areas.

  9. Anonymous
    April 13, 2012 at 8:05 am #

    You’re joking… right?

    • April 13, 2012 at 8:25 am #

      That women should take some responsibility for their own safety, just like men are expected to? Yeah, what was I thinking? It stinks like it’s equality or something…

      • Kathy
        May 4, 2012 at 1:03 am #

        What if a guy dresses really flaboyantly, and gets beaten up for being a ‘faggot’?

        • May 14, 2012 at 8:30 pm #

          That’s a whole new kettle of fish and one I’m keen to jump into another day. It’s one thing for women to be attention seekers, but when a man does it… woah… then there’s trouble. I’ll definitely be writing about this one day.

          • Kathy
            May 14, 2012 at 9:21 pm #

            But the guy should be held partly responsible, right?

          • Kathy
            May 24, 2012 at 8:58 pm #

            My my, ain’t the sound of silence deafening.

        • Rachel
          June 2, 2012 at 4:51 pm #

          Kathy, you brilliant bitch! I adore you. But please do not waste any more of your time with this moron. Caveman logic makes him impervious to critical thinking, as demonstrated by his inability to form any kind of rational conjecture to substantiate his undoubtedly misogynistic claims.

      • Bec
        May 16, 2012 at 12:28 pm #

        I don’t understand this constant reference to men taking responsibility for their own safety. In what context? & how?

  10. April 15, 2012 at 11:33 am #

    I liked this post and for some reason, it even made me laugh. Many, many good points made. And, yes, why flip out over someone’s opinion? People with too much time on their hands who want to show off how sexy they are (in a slut walk?) Somewhat silly all of it. Thanks for the post.

    • April 19, 2012 at 8:39 pm #

      Few things amuse me more than when a group of women all dressed up start turning on each other. Female competitiveness is hilarious, but seldom talked about.

  11. April 15, 2012 at 7:54 pm #

    Good work, brother! It’s nice to see all these rabid feminists coming out of the woodworks and exposing their own stupidity and dishonesty.

    Keep fighting the good fight.

    • April 19, 2012 at 8:41 pm #

      Thanks brother! It’s the least I can do, I still feel some guilt for once being a white knight.

      • Shmaesh
        March 11, 2013 at 2:23 am #

        Because it is so shameful to work in tandem with the women around you than to actively work against them.
        Of all the nonsense you’ve said in this thread, I hope everyone gets to this particular comment. Very telling.

  12. freebird
    April 15, 2012 at 8:02 pm #

    Well done!
    You’ve abused the females with your man-logic,also known as man-splaining.

    This shows no regard for her fweelings.
    Ah well,life is tough in the blog zone,logic is a + in my book.

    Superlative!

    • April 19, 2012 at 8:45 pm #

      Hehehe, logic is abuse! Logic is a tool of teh PATRIARCHY! HAHAHA!

      Cracks me up everytime.

  13. Grizzly
    April 16, 2012 at 6:32 pm #

    I usually like your articles because I’m a men’s rights guy, but I so disagree with the idea of slut shaming. Slut shaming to me is a subtle form of pedestalizing women. That their pussy is so valuable that they should be shamed for giving it out. Old school traditional conservatives are big on this. It ties into the presumed “purity” of a woman, that her sexuality is somehow so much more valuable than a male’s sexuality that it must be protected at all costs. In an age of easy birth control, DNA tests, and abortions, I don’t care if a slut is a slut as long as she’s an honest slut. She has a right to give up sex to as many people as she wants. I only hate sluts when they pretend to be wholesome, because those types of women are liars and hypocrites. Besides, to me slut shaming doesn’t actually rid the world of sluts, it just creates hypocrites, chicks who learn to lie about being sluts or think up all types of weird loopholes, subterfuges, and rationalizations for their sluttiness. Getting rid of slut shaming won’t increase the amount of sluts in the world, it will just increase the amount of honest, open sluts in the world, which will help guys who want to avoid them avoid them, and men who want to screw sluts screw them.

    Not just that, but besides traditional conservatives, who else loves slut shaming? Women, even many feminist ones. Why? Is it for the benefit of men? No, it’s for the benefit of women. Simple economics: sluts and prostitutes lower the market value for vagina, making it harder for women to use access to sex as leverage over men. If sex is available for a price through prostitutes or for free through sluts, it ruins the bargaining power of women who are “good girls.”

    I’m a men’s rights guy, but I have to disagree with you here, although I usually love your articles otherwise.

    • April 17, 2012 at 1:05 pm #

      I acknowledged that my solution is imperfect, but it works better than all the other alternatives that I am aware of or are available to us. I would love to live in a polyamorous society with heaps of sex and communal raising of children, however, polyamory is mostly pushed by women because it benefits women more than it does men. Polyamory is basically matriarchy because paternity is indeterminable so the female line of inheritance takes precedence. I will point out that while on paper all of the free sex looks great, it is important to remember sex isn’t everything, nor is the individual. Our economic system for example depends paternity, without it men just don’t do anything for raising children because they have no incentive to care and far from being society’s protectors they turn into thuggish brutes because violence is the only lever that men have against women in a matriarchy. JtO and GirlWritesWhat did a fantastic radio episode on this topic comparing matriarchy to patriarchy and the differences are startling.

      Another factor is that social shaming is non-violent as a method of enforcement, if you can’t use social shaming you’re left with few viable alternatives except physical violence.

      • Lavabreix
        October 20, 2015 at 11:53 pm #

        You can have sex with a couple of people instead of 30 people. Womens sexuality is not more valueable than males. This is bullshit. HOWEVER it does say something about you personality if you sleep around very much, man or woman.

        Why do people think that the only way to have good sex is when they sleep around? Never heard anything of ”sex in a relationship”??? I dont get it.

        The best thing about sex is the work before you get it. Giving it away for everyone freely isnt good.

    • Kathy
      May 14, 2012 at 9:24 pm #

      Every part of me feels like I should be verbally berating you but I just…can’t…stop…agreeing…?

  14. April 16, 2012 at 7:08 pm #

    This is probably one of the most ridiculous articles I have read in recent times. This is coming from a non-“slut”. You have completely missed the point! The movement is not anti free speech, it is pro individuality, which in turn is pro free speech. What it is against is the incitement of hatred, not just by one policeman but by even society in turn, against certain women for the way they act or dress when it is not inherently harming anyone. Well you could say, are they not hurting themselves? By dressing a certain way are they not just asking to get raped? To assert this is insanely inaccurate. Rape happens regardless of what clothes a women is wearing or how she is acting. I find this akin to saying wow that child is dressing way too cute, her parents are just asking for paedophiles to molest her. Which of course we do not say, because the child’s clothing, was with rape victims, in the majority of cases is irrelevant to the abuses carried out against them. Wait so if they are not hurting themselves, are they not hurting men by leading them a stray and women by taking their boyfriends/husbands. Adultery and being deemed a “slut” do not always go hand in hand. If they woman is single, the blame is really on the man in the committed relationship. He is the one causing the hurt by breaking the trust he has with another person. And do not give me that bullshit about the alluring “slut” who forced him to have sex with her, it’s not really his fault, she was just too “slutty” not to! Again, BULLSHIT! Men have brains just as women do, they are capable of controlling themselves and their actions. If they are realistically being forced into these sexual encounters then the real issue we should be talking about is rape but we are not because there is free will involved. I really just think you have such a warped view of the world. You know, empathy is such a strong thing. If only you could put yourself in the shoes of a women with the natural personality that you deem to be slutty, I wonder how you would react.

    • April 17, 2012 at 8:44 am #

      Hey Olivia, thanks for writing. I’m not sure where you’re pulling those example scenarios from but coming into the discussion at the time you are I encourage you to read the comments above. Not just skim over them either, but really understand them – because then you mightn’t think as many of these men (and women) above had such a warped view.

    • April 17, 2012 at 1:20 pm #

      What Beato said. But there’s also this great comedy sketch on youtube about this person dressed as a policeman, but he’s not really a policeman, so when people ask him to help with a crime being committed he answers, “I might look like a policeman, but you’re being very narrow minded, I’m not actually a policeman and I have no interest in helping you.”

      Now juxtapose this to a woman, who isn’t really a slut, but dresses and acts like one – then apply those wonderful empathy skills to the people looking at this slut and what they might be thinking when they see a non-slut dressed up as a slut acting like a slut. You mentioned men having brains, do women have brains too? Do they not realise the confusion they’re causing when they dress up as sluts when they aren’t really sluts? Or are they just helpless, ignorant idiots who have no idea how provocative their dress sense is?

      I can’t speak for all men, but I can speak with reasonable accuracy for the educated, sensitive, mature and thoughtful men. When they see a women dressed like a hooker, they walk away in the other direction. What kind of men stay behind to hang out with the slut? Certainly not the type of men women claim they want. The slut did this to herself. She selected her own company so to speak.

      • April 18, 2012 at 10:15 pm #

        that you tube vid is a Dave Chappelle bit and he does say that women who dress ‘like a whore’ confuse men by dressing that way, but he also says in the same breath that just because women dress a certain way does not mean they are a certain way… and in fairness to women who want to dress like a ‘slut’ or ‘whore’ they should be free to do so without any unwanted attention from men, men need to be able to control themselves around women no matter what they are wearing or acting like, the onus should not be on women to consider the consequences of how men may react to their dress…

        • April 19, 2012 at 9:14 pm #

          “and in fairness to women who want to dress like a ‘slut’ or ‘whore’ they should be free to do so without any unwanted attention from men, men need to be able to control themselves around women no matter what they are wearing or acting like, the onus should not be on women to consider the consequences of how men may react to their dress…”

          You’ve just fallen for the false stereotype of men as all rapists pushed by feminists.

          It isn’t a case of men needing to control themselves, the overwhelming majority of men do control themselves, if indeed they need to control themselves because they first need to have a desire to rape in order to have something to control. The vast majority of men do not have any urges to rape women. A small proportion of men desire to rape and an even smaller proportion actually do rape. These numbers are so low that they fall into category of extremes – that is products of genetic abberations or abusive backgrounds.

          The next issue then is what is rape? It is not an easy topic. Imagine a couple sitting at home, the woman says, “let’s have sex!” the man says, “I don’t feel like it.” The woman doesn’t accept this and keeps pressuring him to have sex with her, the man decides to have sex with her because he wants to help her out. But was he not technically raped? Was he not forced into sex he didn’t want? This kind of thing happens every day and it most certainly isn’t rape. However, feminists will call this rape if the man is asking for sex, but not when the woman is.

          The fact is, rape makes up only a tiny proportion of all crime. Even when it comes to all violent crime, it is still onyl a tiny proportion of all violent crime. There is no evidence that men have a natural desire to rape women. There is however truckloads of evidence of men sacrificing their lives, livelihoods, dignity and money to please women. If anything, men have a powerful natural desire to protect and provide for women.

          So don’t you dare say “men are bad, but I’m one of the few good men ladies, you’re safe with me,” because it’s slimy and dishonest and any woman with her brain switched on is going to see through it.

          If women have the same rights as men, they logically have the same responsibilities. This means they have to be responsible for their own well-being, they have no right to demand men look after them like children while still expecting to be treated like adults. Women are not helpless children without agency, they are adults, treat them like adults.

          • April 19, 2012 at 9:39 pm #

            Ok, I haven’t fallen for any ‘feminist stereotype’, I am capable of independent thought and I believe the onus is on men not to rape, not for women to dress or act ‘appropriately’ so as not to be raped. I do agree that most men do not rape and am not suggesting otherwise.

            What is rape? It’s pretty clear I thought, it’s essentially someone exercising their power over another person via sex without consent and although that can be broken down into areas of duress, age, power relationships, digital rape etc the situation you describe above I would consider rape, whether it be a man pressuring a woman or a woman pressuring a man or any other combination you want to come up with.

            I would also suggest if you are going to make generalisations (eg. rape stats as a % of all crime etc) and use the word ‘evidence’ you actually provide some for you comments, it would make them a lot stronger.

            “If anything, men have a powerful natural desire to protect and provide for women”. – I agree and do not think that I have suggested otherwise.

            “So don’t you dare say “men are bad, but I’m one of the few good men ladies, you’re safe with me,” because it’s slimy and dishonest and any woman with her brain switched on is going to see through it” – I did not say this, so please do not put words in my mouth.

            “If women have the same rights as men, they logically have the same responsibilities. This means they have to be responsible for their own well-being, they have no right to demand men look after them like children while still expecting to be treated like adults. Women are not helpless children without agency, they are adults, treat them like adults” – I don’t know quite what you are getting at here, I agree with this whole statement and am not suggesting otherwise.

            • April 19, 2012 at 9:52 pm #

              http://www.bjs.gov/content/pub/pdf/cv10.pdf

              Table on page 3

              ^ Rape + sexual assault makes up less than 0.7% of violent crime in the United States.

              Even if that’s under reported, and it is because prison rape of men isn’t counted, it is still a problem not worthy of so much hysteria.

              Otherwise, cool, we’re on the same page. 🙂

              • April 19, 2012 at 10:28 pm #

                Interesting but unsurprising sex breakdown of the stats show that of the 188, 380 people who reported as rape victims (that’s 516 rape victims per day – it might be small percentage but that is a bloody lot of rapes!) 169,370 were women and 15, 020 were men – not suggesting anything! Just sayin’ da facts…

                I guess in addition to male-male prison rape you could also add many unreported rapes within marriage rapes – both ways of course 😉 general unreported rapes and unreported child sexual assaults? Maybe even some more categories. All those would certainly increase the percentage.

                I would argue it IS worth the hysteria and that rape is far more serious than property damage, motor vehicle theft, general assault and some other crimes in the report – the impact on someone’s life, to my understanding, is far greater and longer lasting than many other crimes.

                • April 19, 2012 at 11:44 pm #

                  I wouldn’t take those figures for male rape seriously. The incidence of male-on-male prison rape can only be estimated in the hundreds of thousands. It is not recognised as a crime as such, people generally have the point of view that if someone is in prison they therefore deserve whatever happens to them there and when they aren’t calling it “correctional rape” they’re ignoring it.

                  In any case, the human brain doesn’t cope with stats very well. 516 rape victims per day is nothing in a country with over 300 million people. Or 512 vs 300,000,000.

                  I’m not interested in arguing rape hysteria to be honest. It’s getting off topic.

      • Kathy
        May 14, 2012 at 9:35 pm #

        Dressing as a policeman when you’re not is a silly example. Dressing like a policeman implies that he can help everybody, when he doesn’t want to help anybody. Dressing like a slut implies that you want sex, but maybe you don’t want it with everyone.

        There’s one easy way to find out. It happened in the policeman video.

        ASK HER HERSELF.

        And then-this is the magic part-

        -LISTEN TO WHAT SHE SAYS.

        When the policeman said he didn’t want to help, did they hold him down and FORCE him to handcuff them? Did they drag him down an alleyway and violently insist that he READ THEM THEIR RIGHTS? Did they rip off the policeman uniform and violate him?

        No? Then I’m confused about how this is the same thing.

        • Bec
          May 16, 2012 at 12:34 pm #

          “Dressing like a slut implies that you want sex, but maybe you don’t want it with everyone.”
          This can be used in response to any comment that links dressing like a slut with rape. (ergo, dressing like a slut and being RAPED are completely unrelated)

  15. April 17, 2012 at 1:46 am #

    Okay, this is going to be a lot easier to address all you women at once.

    Read carefully. YOU’RE ALL INSANE…and a bunch of hypocritical whiners.

    You can’t foam at the mouth for your own rights to not be violated and then viciously attack any man who has the guts to factually state how things stand.

    It’s not that I doubt that any of you can read. It’s your ability to pull actual content from the written word I’m questioning.

    • Kathy
      May 14, 2012 at 9:40 pm #

      This may be how things stand, but that’s what we’re trying to change. Whereas some people seem to want to keep male-female sexual relations in the dark ages.

      Did it ever occur to you that the more you slut-shame, the more likely it is that a woman will lie about being raped? Which is disgusting. And that’s more innocent men who are put away for not doing anything wrong.

      Can’t you see that the only way forward is to treat everyone with respect, regardless of whether they’re male or female or whether they say yes or no, and stop trying to tell people that they deserve what they get because of an action they took that hurt nobody and is against no laws?

  16. yaykisspurr
    April 19, 2012 at 9:19 am #

    hehe I stumbled on this blog quite by accident…then I stumbled on this post which seems to be a poster child for what your site is all about.

    I’m probably not as up on news as I should be…I find it rather depressing actually…so I really don’t know what a slutwalk is or that people actually slut shame women. (I wouldn’t even know how to go about it…do you just scream at them or text them or dump flour on them?)

    The comments though were perhaps the most interesting thing about the post (as so much of it was probably over my head). I do have a couple opinions though:

    –I don’t believe any woman deserves to be raped.
    –I believe women should NOT dress provocatively and rub it in men’s faces either.

    There are consequences for every action.

    –If you rape for whatever reason you should go to jail.
    –If you dress provocatively you should not be surprised if you are raped, especially if the men around you are drunk. (so in other words rape is a possible consequence of dressing inappropriately.)

    The writer had a point that children are taught through shame…whenever you scold your child you are saying “for shame, you shouldn’t…fill in the blank.” Whenever you feel the censure of a friend or family member, whether deserved or not, this is manipulation through shame.

    I also think that officer had every right to hold whatever opinion he wanted and he had a really good point (as the writer indicated).

    As for this shaming of a slut…I still don’t understand how one would do this…but it doesn’t seem like a bad idea if for the right reasons and done in an appropriate way (which I can’t comment on because I am extremely obtuse!). Anyway just my opinion. Fascinating post. Cheers 🙂

    • April 19, 2012 at 6:53 pm #

      –If you dress provocatively you should not be surprised if you are raped, especially if the men around you are drunk. (so in other words rape is a possible consequence of dressing inappropriately.)

      wow – I hope you never become a rape counsellor! What a terrible thing to say. No matter how drunk I’ve ever been or how provocatively women around me have dressed (whatever that means?!), I have never raped anyone and I would be surprised if anyone I knew did. What sort of opinion do you have of men? Do you think we have such low self control that when we are drunk and see a skimpily clad women we cannot resist raping her?

      • April 19, 2012 at 9:26 pm #

        “wow – I hope you never become a rape counsellor!”

        She never said she was, nor is this relevant to the topic, it’s an ad hominem and it stinks.

        Again, she said “surprised” not “should be raped”, nor “deserves to be raped” or even “it’s fine to rape.”

        She said none of these things. Her statement was not extreme, nor was it a call to violence. She was just pointing out that these women should be aware that the way they dress will attract a particular kind of man and they shouldn’t be surprised if it’s the thuggish violent type of man.

        Personally, I think most women get turned on by the domineering aggressive male, so they probably deliberately chose to dress like that but took no personal responsibilty for their safety or the risk they were taking.

        • April 19, 2012 at 9:44 pm #

          well what sort of society do we have when women who are dressed ‘provocatively’ (whatever that means) should NOT be surprised if they are raped because they are dressed that way??? I would suggest a pretty sick society…

          • April 19, 2012 at 9:54 pm #

            Actually, I was thinking a society where women are equals to men in dignity and rights. Unless we’re obligated as males to chaperone them everywhere for free?

            • April 19, 2012 at 9:59 pm #

              surely then women should be free to dress how they want and not be ‘surprised’ at being raped?

              • April 19, 2012 at 11:43 pm #

                Just because you can dress how you want doesn’t mean you don’t need to be aware of the image you’re projecting.

                If a person is choosing to ignore risk factors then they should not be surprised at the result. That logic doesn’t just apply to women getting raped. It should be common sense. Don’t smoke in bed if you don’t want your house to burn down. Will the house always burn? No, but there’s a damn good chance that there’s going to be a negative result. Same thing with this rape topic. It’s bad even when there’s not a rape because the attention you attract is still not probably going to be from good people.

                If a woman dresses in an overly sexually provocative manner(which is MY definition of slutty dressing)then she’s saying without words that she is trying to attract a man. Or another woman for that matter. In fact, it’s not just men that rape women. I have heard of situations where a woman rapes another woman. Not as common to be sure but it still happens.
                I’m sure if a man dressed in a comparable way he might attract bad attention as well. The woman that would take note would not really be anything you’d want beyond a maybe a one night stand. And if he went to the right place maybe he’d get molested. Only he wouldn’t be likely to garner praise for dressing in a revealing manner. Where’s the equality in that double standard? It says to me that men praising womens’ slutty dressing just want to look at as much as can be got away with in public.

                So, really, it’s just about attracting bad sexual attention. People are going to assume you’re advertising especially if you combine it with other risk factors such as drinking and using mind-altering substances.

                • April 20, 2012 at 7:44 am #

                  …so if dress if such a major factor then why are mentally disabled people raped on a disproportionate level to the general population, why do old women get raped, children, male – male prison rape (nothing sluttly about prison uniforms). I just think this whole ‘dress’ element to rape is such an outdated unequal notion. Rape is about power, not sex and rapists (male or female) who use dress as some sort of excuse is disgusting.

                  • April 20, 2012 at 11:01 am #

                    I would check your facts if I was you. Rape overwhelming occurs against women between the ages of 18-25 – during their sexual prime. As women get older the risk of rape drops off very steeply. Just because the news report every occasion that a 75 year old or a disabled person gets raped it doesn’t mean that is the norm. Rape is a sexual crime, not a crime of power. Men compete with other men, they don’t compete with women unless they’re a tomboy.

                    • April 20, 2012 at 10:33 pm #

                      actually women’s sexual prime is around the 30 mark, and who cares at what age they are raped, what the hell difference does that make??? rape IS a crime of power, the perpetrator wants to exert power over the victim, not get their rocks off… and what the hell is that tomboy comment? that makes no sense at all???

                    • April 21, 2012 at 7:47 am #

                      A woman’s sexual prime the age of 30?

                      Dude. I’m a biomedical scientist. Grab a science text book and read up on female fertility. Female fertility peaks in the early 20’s and drops off slowly until the late 20’s then starts to drop off very quickly until she’s infertile around the ages of 40-50. That 30 year figure I think comes from that very poorly conducted study about the number of orgasms women have. Since 75 year old women can orgasm and some mothers haven’t experienced orgasm I think it’s safe to say that it’s not hugely relevant to female fertility. Although it does play a role.

                      The Tomboy comment refers to differences in male and female personality. Typically males react with posturing when challenged, like you did then, but I’m sure you’ve noticed it’s a rare woman who responses to posturing by posturing right back to a man. Those women are called Tomboys. This is how competitiveness is triggered. We only compete with with people who posture with us. Hence most men and women don’t compete with the opposite sex, but do compete within their sex. Following?

                      Rape is about sex. It involves sexual organs. It involves sexual drives. It involves sexual acts. This is obvious to see. However, my objection to the feminist (no psychologist came to this conclusion) idea that rape is about power is that it isn’t clear because we aren’t privy to the inner workings of rapist brains. It’s a hypothesis without evidence, it’s needlessly complicated and it lacks predictive power to anticipate future rapes. In other words, it’s wrong.

              • April 20, 2012 at 12:02 am #

                You’re talking about a fairyworld where nobody cries, nobody gets hurt and everyone lives happily ever other. All those “shoulds” you’re using are an indication that you’re talking about a hypothetical world you’d like to live in, but is not the actual world that we do live in.

                People get hurt, people die, people suffer incredibly and worst of all, there is no solution to these problems except complete geneocide of human beings. Because so long as there are people there will be hurting, suffering and dying. It’s an immutable biological fact that no amounts of moral whinging and moaning is ever going to change.

                • Kathy
                  May 14, 2012 at 9:52 pm #

                  Wow, it’s almost like you’re saying that some people will always do bad things regardless of what we do to try and stop them…robbers will rob regardless of locks…rapists will rape regardless of what a woman’s wearing…

                • Verna
                  January 19, 2013 at 8:38 am #

                  … people are total a$$holes that judge everyone else because their own life is lacking so terribly ….

            • Kathy
              May 14, 2012 at 9:47 pm #

              If by ‘chaperone’ you mean ‘don’t rape’ then yes, you are obligated to do that. You know. By law.

              And again, I can only presume that if a man were to dress particularly flamboyantly you would extend the same judgement to him. Yes?

        • Kathy
          May 14, 2012 at 9:43 pm #

          All true, but the key issue seems to be that just because it’s not surprising, doesn’t mean that it’s okay.

          Also, I think you’re getting aggressive and assertive confused.

          Not that I would ever presume to speak for MOST women.

      • yaykisspurr
        April 20, 2012 at 4:09 am #

        The point is there is consequences to our freedoms.

        A man who is drunk has his natural inhibitions lowered. Period. If a man believes a woman is coming onto him and is drunk there is a possibility for a man to rape a woman (in the woman’s eyes) and the man to think he had consensual sex. Dressing provocatively CAN bring this kind of situation on as you are visually saying YES and verbally saying NO. When senses conflict the strongest sense tends to take over, especially when your natural inhibitions are lowered. And visuals tend to be our strongest sense.

        Sure dress the way you want. BUT you might not like the consequences. Just as a man who gets drunk around scantily clad women might not like the outcome either.

        I don’t propose to be a rape counselor but if I were I wouldn’t even take her clothes into account. The rape has happened and is no longer an element in the experience. Dressing properly is about prevention. It’s not about determining wrong doing. If a woman is raped it’s wrong. Period. A man has the responsibility to walk away if he is in a situation where he might do wrong or face the consequences.

        I actually have quite a sound opinion of men. Some are great, some not so great and some are predators. The same can be said of women though. I believe in the law of reciprocal consequences as I explained above.

        I think it quite fascinating that you took my comment so personally. You all on this site are so passionate about your opinions. It’s quite enjoyable. I hope I’ve clarified some of my points. In any case we can always agree to disagree. hehe. Cheers!

    • April 19, 2012 at 9:18 pm #

      These comments have been very interesting, thank you for yours!

  17. Kikki
    April 19, 2012 at 11:04 pm #

    Could you actually provide evidence for the claim that dressing revealingly increases a woman’s chances of being raped? Because the studies I’ve seen on the subject (http://www.law.duke.edu/shell/cite.pl?14+Duke+J.+Gender+L.+&+Pol%27y+125) certainly don’t suggest that, and I’ve yet to find any evidence other can “common sense” to prove that revealing dress impacts rape risk. A lot of your article is predicated on the idea that women who dress provocatively are being irresponsible, and are therefore partly responsible for being raped (and therefore are deserving of less sympathy), but you never actually provide any evidence that this is the case.

    I do believe that there are some easy things that everyone can do to make themselves safer from violent crime, but dressing more conservatively doesn’t seem to be one of them, and so treating one victim more seriously than another because of dress seems a bit baseless and needlessly cruel.

    • April 19, 2012 at 11:57 pm #

      Correct me if I’m wrong, but didn’t I write about sluts, slutwalk, STDs, irresponsible behaviour, freedom of speech and paternity fraud? Rape was mentioned, but it was one part of the bigger whole. You’re attempting to bring it back to rape because the topic of rape is an emotionally charged issue and you’re keen as mustard to trap me into saying, “sluts deserve to be raped because they dressed that way.”

      No. Sluts don’t get raped because of how they dress, but because of how they behave.

      GET. THAT. CLEAR.

      Women are not objects, they have agency. Stop talking about women as though they are objects, it is incredibly sexist and chauvanistic.

      • January 22, 2013 at 12:01 am #

        The only aspect of a woman’s behavior that contributes to the fact that she was raped IS the fact that they have agency and say no (or, in some cases, were not even asked in the first place). If she didn’t have agency there would be no such thing. Nothing else, from her dress, to her past sexual behavior, to her alcohol consumption, to where she chooses to hang out, or anything else causes their rape. Rapists who are egged on by posts like this and people like you who tell them that the slut really DID deserve it because of how they behave contribute. Anyone who tries to claim that the man assumed they wanted sex with them because they wanted sex with someone else is fucking deluding themselves. WHO ASSUMES THAT? Oh yeah, fucking rapists do. Not logical “nice guys.” This is a problem with how we raise men and allow them to communicate with each other without question. The disgusting conversations they have that let their buddies know that they also think some girl in a short skirt who has had sex with someone else they know is asking for it. The way misogynists like you call those men heroes for keeping women in line.

        And seriously, fuck you very much. For every “slut” that got raped, there was a woman who was a virgin, or in a monogamous relationship, or who had very little sex. This idea that only bad girls get raped and good girls don’t is so overwhelmingly ignorant. I can’t even believe this has to be explained to you.

        The only connection between rapes is non-consent. You cannot behave in a way that encourages rape because the definition of rape includes saying no.

        • Anonymous
          September 17, 2014 at 9:28 pm #

          Also, just to add, maybe people like Jason should read the book called “Lucky” by Alice Sebold. A true story about a virgin who got raped. I guess she was acting like a slut?

    • yaykisspurr
      April 20, 2012 at 4:23 am #

      I actually don’t think a man rapes a woman because of their dress. I believe they TARGET a woman because of their dress. As a woman are you naturally drawn to a well dressed woman whose clothes hug her body or a woman wearing a mu-mu for example? Probably the well dressed woman. The same goes with a man and provocative dress. And you’d tend to want to go with the woman saying YES visually than the one saying NO visually. When you’re a predator these signs are particularly important as they tend to be about control. A woman who dresses provocatively is not only saying YES but they are daring a predator with control issues to come get them. It goes some to what Sutherland is saying about behavior – provocative dress tends to be indicative of a type of woman. I’m not saying this is right or good, it’s just the way our world works, until a crime is committed we as a society have limited recourse. Prevention is one of them. (And I’m not saying you can’t dress well as a woman, we’re talking about provocative dress.)

      Off the subject of rape, I am still curious about slut shaming…not sure how this is done?
      Cheers.

      • April 20, 2012 at 11:19 am #

        Here’s an example of some slut-shaming:

        http://www.ebaumsworld.com/video/watch/82460887/

        All we have to do is what comes naturally. Blokes who don’t want to be treated like playthings by women, will stay away from girls who dress like sluts and girls that are known to act like sluts. Any man with self-respect is going to have a low opinion of a woman who dresses or acts like a slut. Any women with self-respect will not dress or act like a slut, she will take care of herself and now rely on playing the sexual celebrity card to pay her way through life.

        Ideally, men would offer no protection to women who treat men like crap. It’s not right that men should risk their safety for women for such heroism to be a treated like it’s a female entitlement. In every place I’ve worked I’ve had to chaperone women around for their protection be it’s just assumed and expected that I’ll provide this bodyguard role for women automatically because I’m a man. Fuck that shit, if I’m supposed to take a knife for a woman I deserved to be treated with respect and gratitude, not like I’m some sex-crazed braindead neanderthal. The sluts can fend for themselves. If they don’t like it, then they can smarten up and start treating the men around them with respect.

        • yaykisspurr
          April 20, 2012 at 4:31 pm #

          Hmmm. Fascinating, thanks for the video.

  18. Astron
    April 20, 2012 at 2:14 am #

    This article made me first kind of angry, but made me really think about this “issue” and here’s some of my views:

    1. The word “slut” is really subjective and people understand it so differently. I find it to be extremely offensive and would probably never say it in a way where I truly mean it to anybody. And the “receiving” part also has his/her’s own idea of what the word “slut” means.

    2. Do you really know anything about the person which you are about to call a slut? Of course you draw conclusions from the persons appearance and his/her’s behaviour, but do you really have any idea of that persons motives or reasons or what kind of perons he/she is, or are you just assuming, that he/she is a slut based on your stereotype of a slut?

    3. You say, that public humiliation of sluts discourages “future sluts” and prevent’s the spread of “sluttness”. I believe that it’s really not that simple, because there are just too many factors which affect our behaviour. Death penalty sure is a way to warn other people about the danger’s of crime, but still when watching the statistics, it really doesn’t seem to help at all preventing crime. This is just an example (and they are different things), but you get my idea. And making someone a cautionary example by sacrificing him/her “for the greater good” doesn’t seem the right way to do. And if someone’s appearance or behaviour doesn’t suit your view of appropriate, you don’t have to shout it out loud, you can say it in a civilized manner somewhere private, which probably is much more efficient way of changing his/her’s behaviour/appearance.

    4. You are an asshole.

    5. Sorry, I had to say it, because as far as I’m concerned, people who encourage slut shaming and calling other people sluts, don’t really behave in an appropriate and civilized manner. It gives me a really confusing message, because their appearance or behaviour doesn’t fit the societys view of an “intelligent citizen”, which they claim to be. It immediately mark’s that person as an unintelligent, unefficient and unprofitable citizen. And best way to avoid this kind of “assholeness” to spread, is by naming him/her asshole, publicly humiliate him/her and destroy the “assholes” possibilities of creating a long-lasting relationship and finding a partner. I have the right to do this and I will encourage others to do so too.
    I’m sure you will understand and no harm intended, of course.

    6. People, who have sex with “sluts” or are attracted to one, are the other part of the problem. I believe, that if nobody liked sluts in any way, there wouldn’t be so many “sluts” (of course slutness is subjective and emphasis on the word “so many”). So being a slut means drawing attention to oneself, and this article sure give’s it attention, like the Slutwalk. What I’m saying, both sides are as guilty for the slutness. If somebody dresses and behaves like a slut and notices, that it is not giving him/her the attention/partner/treatment he/she was looking for, there’s a good change that he/she will change his/her behaviour. Women and men alike should be able to control their behaviour and sexual drive. If someone act’s like a slut, it doesn’t justify a single rape/assault/anything. It can certainly increase the risk of such action to happen and everybody should think how they behave and how other people see you, but it doesn’t justify anything. If a man volunteers to give a woman a drive to home, he shouldn’t expect any refund from the woman unless they have agreed on something. The man was VOLUNTEERING and my logic says, that you can’t demand other people to give you something because you gave them something voluntary.

    offtopic: this whole men’s right and feminism are just really confusing me. Both seem to hate each other, but still they both want the same thing, gender equality. If I ask from a feminist why can’t feminism and men’s right be united to a gender equality movement, the answer is “men’s rights movement is just anti-feminism and against women and we would like to unite for a gender equality movement, but they are just hating us” and if I ask a men’s right-person the same question they answer “feminism is just anti-male and against men’s rights and we want gender equality, but they just hate us”. This is just so incredibly stupid!!!!!!!! (and I know people are going to be like “feminism is women over man” and “men’s rights are men over women”)

    • April 20, 2012 at 11:24 am #

      1. You’re a bitch
      2. You’re a bitch
      3. You’re a bitch
      4. You’re a bitch
      5. You’re a bitch
      6. You’re a bitch
      Offtopic: You’re a bitch

      Oh? Wait you wanted a serious and respectful reply? Fuck that shit. You treat me like trash, I’ll treat you like trash back. What? You had to say I’m an arsehole? What are you? A wild animal with no self-control? You disrespect yourself.

      Clean out the pointless hyperemotional vitriol from your post and I’ll give you a serious reply. Otherwise, just fuck off.

      • April 20, 2012 at 6:52 pm #

        Jason, she took the time to write a pretty huge reply. Don’t rush into yours when you’re fuming… that’s the most difficult thing about Intentious I guess… we encourage people to write what they want, vitriolic or not… and yes I guess that includes our authors. She called you an arsehole, which automatically makes her look like a fool in front of the thousands of silent readers who watch these comment wars take off. The issue and the point of view is bigger than one person, so Astron, please keep personal attacks out of it.

        But still, Jason you at least partially represent the site, and the site calling people bitches is generally a no-no.

        Regardless, you’ve got the upper hand here – tens of thousands of people have read your article – and the very point is to stir people up 😛 Then again, if Astron were to approach us wanting to write an article of his/her own, (all personal attacks out of it of course) Intentious would be inclined to let her.

      • AC
        April 22, 2012 at 4:05 pm #

        Wow, way to follow up a completely poorly reasoned piece of shit article by trying to shame a woman into silence for disagreeing with you. UR A REEL MAN.

        • April 23, 2012 at 9:53 am #

          Wow, way to follow up a completely understandable reaction to being spoken to disrespectfully by shaming a man for standing up for himself. See, if women are equal to men, then they’re strong enough to take heat the same as any man is, however, you’re implying that women are pathetic inferior beings who cannot cope with big scary men giving them heat as good as they give it to men.

          Let’s go through this again slowly so you can get this:

          She called me an arsehole, that was a challenge to my dignity, if I let that slide and just respond civily then I look weak because I’m letting someone walk all over me.

          If I respond by retaliating, calling her a bitch, and refusing to answer unless she repeats her question without calling me an arsehole… I’m also weak because I’m picking on a weakling little girl?

          So, either way, I’m weak? What other option do I have? Surrendering to female supremacy? Fuck that shit. I don’t care if you’re a man, or a woman, you treat me with disrespect, you get consequences. That’s equal. That’s fair. That’s life.

          • Belle
            May 14, 2012 at 5:15 pm #

            So, let me get this straight: you’re entitled to not only call women sluts, but actually encourage others to do the same… yet, nobody is allowed to call you any derogatory names because that’s acting in a disrespectful manner? You say that Astron has shamed you for standing up for yourself, yet you actively seek to shame women (by calling them sluts) for standing up for their right to wear the clothes they want without fear of rape. By completely dismissing and not engaging meaningfully with Astron’s reply, you’ve made yourself look like a massive hypocrite.

            • Kathy
              May 14, 2012 at 10:04 pm #

              Yus.

      • Kathy
        June 19, 2012 at 1:56 am #

        ‘What? You had to say I’m an arsehole? What are you? A wild animal with no self-control?’

        The hypocrisy is just….mind-boggling. Truly.

        • June 23, 2012 at 9:42 am #

          This reminds of Ayn Rand (now she was a genius, and anti-feminist) and a quote she had about people who merely shouted “hypocrite!” as though that was an argument in itself. Intellectually lazy. Articulate why I’m a hypocrite, or accept that I’m just going to laugh at you for being so childish.

          • Kathy
            July 18, 2012 at 11:19 pm #

            Ayn Rand? Lack of understanding of basic English? Haha! I get it now! You’re trolling! Nobody could be this slow-witted.

          • Kathy
            July 19, 2012 at 12:03 am #

            Or, in your own words,

            ‘Are you asking me to come up with arguments against my position for you? Are you that inept?

            Sorry, I don’t do handouts. You’ll have to use your brain and come back to me with a reasoned response.’

  19. Astron
    April 20, 2012 at 1:55 pm #

    Sorry, I really didn’t meant to say that you really are ann asshole, I tried to be sarcastic and wanted to raise the question, that in which ways me calling you now “asshole” differs from you calling somebody a slut? Isn’t the reason behind slut shaming that, that we don’t think the subjects behaviour is appropriate in our society? How does this differ from this following situation of me calling people who do this “assholes”? And I’m sorry, I really didn’t mean to cause any harm to you.

    • April 20, 2012 at 4:11 pm #

      The only person I have any intention of calling a slut is a slut. I will do it because they have acted in ways that are harmful or dangerous to themselves or others. So I would be shaming someone for something that they have done or continue to do.

      You called me an arsehole not for calling anyone a slut, but because I wrote an article about sluts. So you’re shaming me for expressing an opinion. That’s not cool. That’s a bitchy thing to you, so I’ll call you out as a bitch for it.

      Me calling you a bitch was motivated by the desire to get to you stop, think about what you wrote and change your approach when communicating with me. Which is what happened. I wasn’t trying to silence you, I didn’t want to stop you from asking your questions, but I will not tolerate being talked to like that when I haven’t committed any offence. Keep your discourse civil, polite and on the topic and you won’t ever be called a bitch with justification.

      • Belle
        May 14, 2012 at 5:33 pm #

        So if I was to assume that you actually do partake in slut-shaming in real life as you advocate to – when you call a woman a slut in real life, do you do this in a civil and polite manner, so as not to cause offence? Do you actually use the word ‘slut’? And if the woman feels like she is being talked to in a disrespectful manner, is she allowed to call you an asshole? Or is that restricting your free speech?

        • May 14, 2012 at 7:34 pm #

          To be honest, I’ve not had to tell women they’re sluts, they usually just come straight out and admit it. I think it’s a guilty conscience personally. But I’ll let you know if/when it happens.

          Of course they’re free to call me an arsehole. But so what? At the end of the day I don’t give a shit because I don’t feel guilty or ashamed for speaking the truth, and well besides, she’s still a slut.

          Belle, I really think you don’t understand me on this. I don’t feel responsible for women’s hurt feelings. I have no interest in protecting women’s feelings. I don’t get anything out of sucking up to women to make them feel special. I only feel responsible to me, my feelings and my needs.

          For example, your beloved pet cat could die, I would feel sympathetic for you, but I won’t feel ANY desire whatsoever to try and console you. It sucks, but they’re your feelings and you have to wear them fair or not.

          • Kathy
            May 14, 2012 at 10:19 pm #

            Nobody ever ‘has’ to tell a woman she’s slut.

            And for someone who doesn’t give a shit about being called an asshole, that’s a pretty abusive (about seven times as abusive as the original post) little temper tantrum you had there.

      • Kathy
        May 14, 2012 at 10:07 pm #

        A woman who wears a slutty outfit at home, alone, is not putting herself or anyone else in danger. It’s when she leaves the house that the danger begins. Therefore, it is not HER putting herself in danger; it’s those who would attack her for her choice.

      • Kathy
        May 14, 2012 at 10:12 pm #

        I have been polite to you throughout all of my comments and you’ve been rude to me, and I’ve had no apology, despite calling you on it in a polite manner.

        Twice.

        Also I’m interested to know, if a woman does remain polite, civil and on-topic, what ‘justification’ you could have for calling her a bitch…?

      • Kathy
        May 31, 2012 at 9:53 pm #

        ‘So you’re shaming me for expressing an opinion’

        Because you would never DREAM of doing such a thing!

    • April 20, 2012 at 6:53 pm #

      Thanks for the apology Astron.

  20. April 20, 2012 at 3:35 pm #

    This article is the complete inverse of why I say we should no longer use the word “slut” in a similar article on this site. I see this article here as a celebration of witchhunts, and ignorance.

    I will leave the rest of my contention in my own article over which James and I have already had a previous discussion, and pray he is not as irrationally insensitive to this comment.

    The question I would leave is: are you with the woman that you believe you deserve?

    If not, may I suggest that removing the wall that the word “slut” builds, you may find her on the other side of the targets of one’s own prejudice and stereotyping. Because the weakest point of slut shaming- it is entirely dependent on hearsay and gossip to judge someone unfairly.

    That being said, I am supportive of women dressing more conservatively from a risk management perspective, as I said in the previous slutwalk article.

  21. NM
    April 21, 2012 at 1:24 am #

    No respectable, self thinking woman, “feminist” or not, would ever find this pro-slut protest acceptable. To be so deluded to think you are, as a woman, somehow reclaiming/ reinventing the word “slut” and your dignity by having some sort of “right” to dress like a “slut” is so contradictory in terms that it is outright comical.

    • April 21, 2012 at 7:52 am #

      I agree of course, but have you seen the slutwalk websites? It requires serious cash and organisation to get things like that off the ground. I’d love to know where they get the money from and who is financing a movement to turn women into sluts.

    • Kathy
      May 14, 2012 at 10:17 pm #

      I think you’ll find everyone has a ‘right’ to dress however they want so long as it doesn’t incite hatred against others. There’s nothing in the law about inciting rape-urges, and that’s because those urges are not animal or uncontrollable. If they were, then yes, it would be illegal to dress like a slut. It is not illegal to dress like a slut, but it is illegal to rape.

  22. NM
    April 21, 2012 at 8:49 am #

    Good question Jason. Sounds like a topic to research. I personally, as a woman, agree & would also love to be made aware of who exactly is funding & further encouraging this nonsense.

  23. Anonymous
    April 22, 2012 at 3:58 pm #

    <<>

    You realize that these women that you’re referring to are probably not the women that are empowered by feminism, right?

    • April 23, 2012 at 10:00 am #

      I have no idea:

      1. Which women you’re referring to (sluts, slutwalkers, or the women who disagree with slutwalk?)
      2. How feminism empowers women (to be more dependent on the state?)

      So I can’t answer this comment.

  24. James
    April 22, 2012 at 7:55 pm #

    Jason! My man. I just stumbled into this site, but I definitely agree with your article with regards to slut shaming. As to pro-feminist readers who are getting all riled up, I strongly suggest that you look over some of Jason’s replies carefully before erupting into your indignant replies. I think it is perfectly clear that promiscuous sexual activities from both men and women are not desirable in our society, as Jason pointed out. Therefore, I see absolutely no wrong in calling out both men or women a “slut,” a word with a very negative and weighted connotation, if it means that such negative behaviors can be curved in our society.

    Furthermore, as this world is not perfect, heterosexual men will, and always will, equate the way women dress with their sexual promiscuity, regardless of their race or class. That will not change no matter how many slutwalks are performed in America. By taking yourself out of such situation by dressing properly ( a situation that you have control over) , you can prevent the advancement of potential would-be rapist (a situation that you do not have control over). No one is saying those women who dress slutty deserves to get raped. This message is simply a very pragmatic suggestion that could possibly save someone from getting raped (I know most feminists don’t want to hear this, but it must be said). If you wear a t-shirt that says “DTF,” for example, then you would obviously have a higher likelihood of getting raped as you reveal your intention to be a “slut” to the world . Instead of encouraging women to dress slutty to fight the male dominance, encourage women to dress more responsibly to prevent such case to begin with. This is the issue that we should be protesting for, not by wasting our precious university money on funding asinine protests like slutwalk, which my school do btw.

    You may say that it is a male-dominated culture that needs to change, not the way women dress. Well, the men (or women for that matter) who rapes will always be around, whether you like it or not, unless some drastic approach is considered. They will continue to torment young and vulnerable women, and scantily dressed drunk women are generally their easy target. So until these men are somehow eradicated from the world, I believe in putting protection of women in the forefront by encouraging more conservative clothing.

    Thanks for reading! Keep up the good work, Jason!

    • April 23, 2012 at 10:02 am #

      Thanks brother… ooops, I shouldn’t have said that, now they’re going to think we’re part of a conspiracy!

    • Kathy
      May 14, 2012 at 10:28 pm #

      You seem to have misunderstood. We know there will always be rapists. What we’re protesting is blaming a woman for a man’s choice to rape her. Yes, a woman who dresses sluttily is more likely to be sexually attacked, but that doesn’t make it her fault. If a woman says no, than that has to be respected. And if a woman did say no, then it’s rape, was against her will regardless of what she was wearing and she’s not to be blamed. Only a small number of men are rapists and we don’t want to have our choices dictated by a minority of criminals-or indeed, anybody but ourselves.

      What we’re protesting is victim-blaming. Do you ever think that a woman who dresses sluttily deserves to be attacked on that basis? If no, then we’re on the same side.

  25. Laura M
    April 25, 2012 at 2:27 pm #

    I love it how I said some guy got into a cab with me and I said I didn’t want him to, and immediately it was assumed that it was my fault. As for whether I “encouraged” him at all, no I didn’t. He didn’t buy me a drink, he was someone with a group of friends I was with who tried to dance with me, kiss me and when he wouldn’t take no for an answer I left and he followed me into a cab. And I felt in danger, and none of it was my fault. I asked him to leave the cab, he wouldn’t. I asked him to stop touching me, and he wouldn’t. But of course it’s my fault right?

    • April 25, 2012 at 2:49 pm #

      Some advice, and I’m not blaming the victim nor excusing his behaviour by offering this advice to you, the next time you’re in that situation yell at him and tell him to fuck off. 99 times out of 100 it will embarrass the shit out of him and he’ll bug off.

      • heratyck
        April 25, 2012 at 9:44 pm #

        Right… This is exactly what I was referring to when I talked about women needing to have strong boundaries and the willingness to enforce them. It seems like a lot of women are reluctant to be loud/aggressive/crass, they’re just not brought up to talk like that. But sometimes it’s the only way to get your message across.

        • April 25, 2012 at 10:07 pm #

          Heratyck, you might be interested in my piece I published today on “The Virtue of Intolerance,” because being tolerant of someone’s bad behaviour is just as bad as encouraging them. The only way to stop bad behaviour is to feed it bad consequences, i.e. stand up for yourself. Women are accustomed to men defending their boundaries, in fact they often feel entitled to it. But if women want to be as independent as men are expected to be that means they need to take on the responsibility of guarding their own boundaries. Unless of course they want to return to being submissive housewives with husbands doing that for them.

          • Kathy
            May 14, 2012 at 10:38 pm #

            Who on earth are these women you know who seem to need you to fight their bettles all the time?

            I completely agree that by tolerating behaviors you are, by default, allowing it. But a woman who says no is not tolerating it-she just shouldn’t have to say no more than once. Another person’s refusal to listen constitutes a failure on their part, not mine.

            This is why enthusiastic consent is also so important-everybody needs to start accepting that a yes is where the good sex is at, and that a no is a no.

            Women need to be taught this as well, that this whole ‘win me over, chase me, work for it’ mentality is downright dangerous-a no should really BE a no, and not a ‘maybe’. Women shouldn’t encourage that behaviour from a man, and any man who encounters it, I advise you to say ‘okay’ and find someone who’ll be happy to say yes all night. That way you keep yourself safe and far away from the women who give real victimes a bad name by crying rape, and into the life of someone who’ll be openly appreciative of your attention. Anybody who wants to play that kind of game isn’t only lazy and disrespectful, they’re a danger to society.

            • heratyck
              May 15, 2012 at 12:22 am #

              “But a woman who says no is not tolerating it-she just shouldn’t have to say no more than once. Another person’s refusal to listen constitutes a failure on their part, not mine.”

              Again, I think there’s too much focus on how things ‘should’ be and not enough on ‘how things actually are’. Yes, in an ideal world you should only have to say “no” once, but this isn’t an ideal world and sometimes you have to repeat yourself/be loud/crass etc, in order to get your point across.

              • Kathy
                May 15, 2012 at 12:36 am #

                So you know that this is how it ‘should’ be but you can’t empathise with people who are trying to make it so? I’m trying to make it a perfect world, but I’m expected to temper my behaviour and clothing choices due to the people who make it miserable?

                You say that we have to have strong boundaries and be willing to enforce them. That is exactly what we’re doing. I completely fail to see what the Slutwalk is if not loud and crass, and we’re enabling all those who aren’t brave enough to fight back alone, in every cab or empty dark street, to get a point across. Our boundaries are that we will not be raped, and we will not be shamed, and the more people know that the closer we’re getting to a perfect world, one baby step at a time.

                You can never have too much focus on how things should be.

                • heratyck
                  May 15, 2012 at 1:21 am #

                  “So you know that this is how it ‘should’ be but you can’t empathise with people who are trying to make it so?”

                  I have no problems empathizing with idealists so long as they’re grounded by a little realism… 😉

                  “I’m trying to make it a perfect world, but I’m expected to temper my behaviour and clothing choices due to the people who make it miserable?”

                  Why would anyone’s expectations of you matter? Who’s making it miserable for you?

                  The basic problem I see with the slutwalk movement is the whole enabling/empowering factor. To enable women with power implies that they don’t have it currently. Power isn’t necessarily a tangible thing… More often than not, it’s a mindset. And IMO, young women need to be taught that they already possess power without feeling like they need to embrace and/or re-frame derogative terms or justify their sexuality in order to do so.

                  • Kathy
                    May 15, 2012 at 2:18 am #

                    The people making me miserable are the people who insinuate that a woman who dresses revealingly is in some way to blame for any assault on her.

                    I can see where you’re coming from with your hesitance over ‘reclaiming the word slut as ‘, but I believe that what Slutwalk is hoping to achieve with this is not so much taking it back, but stripping it of it’s power against us. Personally I don’t think that the word slut should exist, but being grounded in (and recognizant of) reality, we know that the more we fight it, the worse the associations will become. By our reckoning, it’s okay to be everything that the word ‘slut’ has come to imply, and so instead of fighting it as a hateful label for a legitimate way to live open, sexual, proud) we’re trying to re-define the associations with it and make people realise that people living their lives freely and without fear of judgement or attack can only ever be a good thing.

                    Compare it with ‘nigger’, a word well on it’s way to being ‘taken back’ by the population is was originally used against-now, to hear someone use that word shows the ignorance and malice of the person using it, rather than being derogatory to the person it is aimed at.

                    And finally I do agree that power is a state of mind, that every woman should have the power to stand up against any guy who won’t take no for an answer, and that hearing so many women contradicting the age-old myth that a woman who dresses sluttily is asking to be raped or treated with less respect will hopefully give hope and a voice to any women who’ve been shamed into silence. That is what the Slutwalk is for.

              • January 22, 2013 at 12:29 am #

                Meanwhile you’re living in a fantasy world where being mean and crass means you don’t deal with even more aggression, physical threat, assault, rape, harassment, the list goes on. I’m notorious for my big mouth and being able to cut dudes who don’t respect me and my girlfriends down with my words and it often leads to dudes who try to get even louder with me and posture and tower over me to try and intimidate and threaten me. I see my friend being harassed by a man who wants her to take some random drink she doesn’t want and didn’t ask for, and didn’t even see where it came from, and I get labeled the “fucking bitch” who reasserted her no and told him to back off. There is a problem with that man who thinks it’s his right to dominate an unwilling woman and if you’re doing anything besides calling that man the scumbag that he is then you’re part of the problem.

                • January 27, 2013 at 4:39 am #

                  “Meanwhile you’re living in a fantasy world where being mean and crass means you don’t deal with even more aggression”

                  If asserting your boundaries in a firm and clear manner is making you the target for physical assault and/or rape then maybe you’re in the wrong place hon. I wasn’t suggesting that being loud and crass could prevent an assault. If someone is determined to assault you, then being loud and crass probably wont deter them much. However, it will usually put an end to the unwanted advances of your ordinary/everyday persistent male who thinks that if they can win your favor if they bug you enough.

                  “and I get labeled the “fucking bitch” who reasserted her no and told him to back off.”

                  So why is that a problem? You’re being labeled a “fucking bitch” by the insecure asshole with the wounded ego… Of course he’s going to call you a bitch (or some equivalent insult), that’s what insecure assholes do in order to save face. So what does it matter what he calls you?

      • January 22, 2013 at 12:20 am #

        Oh except for all those times he’ll try to further intimidate you or even physically attack you. A woman didn’t just make headlines for getting stabbed by someone who catcalled her or anything. Are you kidding me with this nonsense? The men who don’t respect a respectful no damn sure do not respect an aggressive one. They take it as a chance to try to further assert their warped sense of manhood. I’ve seen it and personally experienced it time and time again. The only thing that makes them stop is getting kicked out by a bouncer or otherwise physically removed from the situation. And even then you need to have a group of friends walk with you to your car just in case the creep is lurking in the parking lot.

        Oh wait, that’s more lived experience that you don’t care about. Sorry that reality is pretty much the exact opposite of your fantasies.

        • January 27, 2013 at 6:01 am #

          “A woman didn’t just make headlines for getting stabbed by someone who catcalled her or anything.”

          Again, no where did I suggest that you could prevent an assault from a determined attacker by firmly enforcing your boundaries. If someone has criminal intent towards you (or is otherwise mentally unstable) then what you say or how you say it is usually of little consequence. Unfortunately, the woman in San Francisco would have most likely been harmed or assaulted regardless of what she had said. Her attacker was out late at night, propositioning women who were out walking alone, WHILE ARMED WITH A KNIFE… He obviously wasn’t just looking for a hookup.

          “The only thing that makes them stop is getting kicked out by a bouncer or otherwise physically removed from the situation. And even then you need to have a group of friends walk with you to your car just in case the creep is lurking in the parking lot.”

          Again, this is where I would suggest that maybe you’re hanging out in the wrong places… A bar/club is full of young, testosterone driven males who are all competing with one another while under the influence of copious amounts alcohol or drugs. Not exactly a hotbed for good judgement or conscientious behavior.

    • April 26, 2012 at 12:20 am #

      Look, Laura, I’m sorry that you’re such a chronic victim that you couldn’t be effective. Some men are more aggressive than others and you have to be more aggressive when you say no. Sorry, but I don’t feel bad for you. You could have seperated yourself from the situation at anytime. In the future, hanging out in the same group of people with someone you disdain is a bad idea. If the group is unwilling to intervene when someone is actually being an asshole then they’re not your friends.
      Instead of repeatedly asking a man like that to leave here’s a good formula to follow. First refuse as politely as you feel able. Doesn’t work? Refuse adamently and loudly. Still doesn’t work? Get out of the damn cab in a populated area and get in a different cab. Thus, you take steps to assure your own safety instead of relying on someone elses’ good will that may not exist.

      • E.C.
        May 2, 2012 at 5:44 am #

        Tamiko, HE should have complied with her request the first time. You weren’t there and don’t know all the details surrounding it, but you are quick to tell her how she was wrong and how you would’ve handled it so much better. It is ARROGANT and IGNORANT to think it couldn’t happen to you and that you are safe just be cause you say no repeatedly and loudly. It can happen to anyone, street smart or not.

        • May 2, 2012 at 10:32 am #

          lol. Back to “life should be an endless fairy tale where people never cheat, never lie and never die.”

          The fact is, this guy probably got lucky using this tactic before because somewhere in the world there is a woman who likes men who behave like this. Also, there’s this theme here of fear mongering… all men are potential rapists… well yeah… but all women are potential murderers too… so should I live my life in fear of all women? This fear argument is also interesting. Generally speaking, women are more fearful than men. So fear tactics to manipulate women into hating men like this are more likely to succeed than trying to convince men to develop an irrational fear of women.

          Anyway this is getting academic. The best solution is to make a big noise and assert your boundaries. Don’t appear weak and you won’t be attacked. I’ve been on the receiving end of some unwanted male sexual attention in my life, I asserted my boundaries and never thought about it again. No fear of going out in public, no irrational fear of all homosexuals. I took charge of my situation, I owned my responsibility to myself and I survived.

          I have read advice to women on what to do when threatened with rape and it has been to just surrender, just give in, just be quiet and go along with it. Otherwise he might be more violent. I think the best advice is to choose your friends wisely, respect your friends at all times, avoid potentially dangerous groups of men, stay close to your friends and don’t feel embarrassed to yell and make a big noise if someone is disrespecting you. I would give this advice to a man as readily as to a woman. It won’t work in every situation, but it will work in most.

          • E.C.
            May 3, 2012 at 7:45 am #

            I didn’t say anything in my comment about the need for women to be fearful of all men nor make any statement that sounded like man-hating. Sure, you could liken it to being afraid of being murdered by any woman, but would be would your basis for thinking this way? Men are most often killed by men, actually. Most victims of sexual assault are women and most perpetrators are men. I’m just pointing out the facts. Taking note of that fact doesn’t mean that we need to fear or hate all men, it just means that we need to look at why so many men are committing sexual assault so we can figure out how to change and prevent that behavior.

            On one hand you are telling women not to dress a certain way because they will put themselves at risk of being raped and on the other hand you’re saying that women’s fear of being raped by men is irrational. Which is it?

            Also, “don’t appear weak and you won’t be attacked” is a prejudiced assertion with no factual basis. People of all sorts are raped, including men who don’t appear weak, and most often it isn’t done through a violent attack. Again, it’s usually done by someone the victim knows who has managed to become trusted enough as to be around when the victim is vulnerable.

            Unwanted male sexual attention isn’t the same thing as being sexually assaulted. Many women deal with unwanted sexual attention quite often and can deal with that just fine. Some men leave it at that, others decide that they aren’t going to respect a woman’s boundaries when she tries to enforce them.

            It really bothers me that you are telling women how they can avoid being raped in most situations. May I ask how you became the authority on that? I am by no means the go-to expert with all the answers, but I have 6 years working with survivors and can tell you that many people have done all the things you suggest and still been victimized.

      • May 2, 2012 at 5:30 pm #

        I’m on Laura’s side here guys, it’s a two-way street. Why? The guy should have complied. The fact that he didn’t and instead chose to abuse his right or be a complete perv/creep doesn’t automatically make me go “oh well, he didn’t do the right thing, I guess now it’s the girl’s fault for not flaring up the situation”. Do you know what could happen if a girl yells at a guy in a cab, or does something drastic like asks the cab driver to stop so she can get out?

        a) The guy, who, remember, is a fucking creep, can get out and follow the girl down some random road where another cab might not show up for hours.
        b) The guy, who has just been yelled at, could get aggressive, which, when mixed with liquor, which is the usual formula, is a bad, dangerous situation.

        I think your advice is poor. If you were in such a situation, you might hesitate about what to do too: something that doesn’t possibly flare up the guy who is on a razor’s edge from sexual assault already.

        • August 23, 2012 at 10:54 pm #

          Wow. You should note that I said a WELL POPULATED AREA.

          And it’s interesting how you think a woman saying No is inflammatory to the sex crazed male stereotype you seem to think exist. That is total bullshit and it just feeds the fear that women are supposed to experience around men.

          For your information, my ‘poor advice’ is advice that I follow and guess what? IT WORKS. I have NEVER been harassed in the way that Laura describes and not successfully dealt with it.

          • January 22, 2013 at 12:43 am #

            And what if there isn’t a well populated area to flea to? What if there is but that’s also filled with creeps. Women get sexually harassed in public, on the sidewalk, during the day, felt up on crowded subways, raped at parties. You think she is somehow magically safe because there are a bunch of strangers around? Have you ever heard of the bystander effect? That situation where dozens of people have watched rapes, assaults, and murders and not a single person stepped in or called 911?

            What about all of us women who have been harassed BY CAB DRIVERS WE TRUSTED TO TAKE US TO OUR DESTINATION TO AVOID BEING HARASSED? It’s happened to me. I had a cab drive hold $15 of my change hostage until I’d agree to give him my phone number which he was planning on immediately dialing at the moment to make sure “I had his.” And then when I reported him to the cab company he lied about the fact that he texted me and called me for days after despite my not responding.

            You’ve never been harassed like that? Well, you’ve been lucky so far, but it only takes one time before you realize that sometimes it doesn’t matter what you do, someone wants to hurt you and they will do whatever it takes to do it. That’s when you get the hint that blaming the victim is the most pointless and counterproductive thing you could possibly waste your time doing.

      • Kathy
        May 4, 2012 at 12:55 am #

        I didn’t realise that a woman has to say ‘no’ a certain number of times before it becomes true…?

        • heratyck
          May 4, 2012 at 9:23 am #

          Some people don’t take no for an answer… especially if it’s said in a passive or polite way. It can betray a sense of uncertainty or weak resolve, which leads them to believe that if they just keep on, you’ll eventually cave.

          • Kathy
            May 15, 2012 at 2:24 am #

            Does the same apply to ‘yes’ if I only say it once, in a passive or polite way and with a sense of uncertainty? Presumably a man would ask me again just to be sure?

            • heratyck
              May 22, 2012 at 2:28 am #

              Generally speaking, no (and I really mean it!)… And that doesn’t just apply when men are asking for something, that goes for anyone, regardless of gender. It is often hard for us to question a “yes”, when that’s the answer that we wanted to hear… To do so would create dissonance, and we’d deal with that dissonance by telling ourselves that the other person is honest, capable, rational, and/or otherwise perfectly able to make such a decision, and that if they really wanted to decline, then they would have.

              • Kathy
                May 24, 2012 at 9:12 pm #

                But when they DO decline, because they are honest, capable, rational and/or otherwise perfectly able to make such a decision, regardless of how polite a tone they say it in, it’s okay to just carry on?

                • May 25, 2012 at 4:43 am #

                  Is it okay to try and persuade a person to change their mind even after they’ve declined? Sure, I suppose… up to a point. As long as I seem like I’m willing to hear someone out, then they can go ahead and try and convince me to change my mind. However, if my “no” is firm, and I’ve made it absolutely clear that I’m not willing to entertain their spiel and yet they still keep on… Well then they’re just being a tool and asking for a punch to the throat.

                  • J
                    September 17, 2012 at 10:40 pm #

                    ‘I didn’t realise that a woman has to say ‘no’ a certain number of times before it becomes true…?’

                    Anyone who has interacted with women to any significant extent will be familiar with the Bitch Shield and Last Minute Resistance, whereby a woman resists or offers a contrived ‘no’ to sexual advances, so as not give up the goods too easily. The purpose being to test the guy has the constitution to persist until she has made him work hard enough and deflect any accusations of slut-baggery. This is behaviour that feminists will deny exists but that most men on this forum will have encountered, and most women found themselves subconsciously doing, at some point in their lives. Of course, if he gives up and walks away she’ll just cackle with her fellow harpies that he wasn’t ‘man enough’ to hang in there.

                    The ambiguity surrounding ‘no’ in male-female interaction is due largely to women’s contradictory use of it, as well as the constant games and mixed signals women like to refer to as ‘innocent flirting’.

      • Rachel
        June 2, 2012 at 5:51 pm #

        Tamiko, you are an embarrassment to our gender. Next time a thought pops up into that pretty little head of yours, show it no mercy.

        • August 23, 2012 at 11:05 pm #

          Rachel. You admit that I have thoughts and act like I have no right to share them. You must be so jealous. Respectfully, FUCK YOU. Oh dear, that’s another thought that popped into my admittedly ‘pretty little head’. Like that?

          Fucking proud skanks like YOU are the problem. YOU are the embarrassment to our SEX.

          If you have something useful or constructive happen to fall out of that hole on your face, get back to me. Until such an unlikely event you will get like for like, you cunty slut.

    • May 15, 2012 at 8:55 am #

      Not your fault at all Laura! What I would have said, “Taxi driver, this strange man is not welcome in this cab , please take us to the police station. If you can, call 000 and report a sexual assault.” Yell it.

  26. April 26, 2012 at 8:20 am #

    I find so many of the arguments on this column so patently ridiculous as to be infantile. If I go for a walk in the Serengeti wearing Lady Gaga’s meat suit, im going to get my ass eaten. The fact that it is the Lions “fault” doesn’t negate the fact that I was an idiot.

    Does this mean that I “should” get eaten? No, does it mean that the Lion is “right” to eat me? No, does it change the fact that the government is going to hunt down and kill the Lion? No. Was I freaking stupid for going out in a meat suit to the jungle? Yes.

    I dont think anyone out of the entire 110+ comments actually endorsed rape, nor did anyone ever say that those who did the raping were anything less then scum. What has been said, over, and over, and over again, was that when a woman goes to a club dressed “like a slut” she attracts the wrong kind of attention. In that instance, (just like my stinking meat suit) She shouldnt be surprised if something happens. There are several people on this forum who apparently think that the slut label applies to them… well, if the shoe fits?

    If not then why be offended? It is a terrible trend in the modern world that its ALWAYS someone elses fault, we dont believe in taking responsibilities for our own actions. If you can look at your actions and honestly cant see anything you could have done better when something horrendous happens? Well….. your an idiot.

    Just my 2 cents.

    • April 26, 2012 at 9:19 am #

      Excellent analogy with Lady Gaga and the lion. It sounds like an educational book title for teenagers for responsible behavior.

      A woman once said to me that she feels sorry for feminists who think they’re smart because the reality is there is an unbroken chain of feminists from kindergarten to academia so their hateful attitude to men is constantly reinforced as they grow up and their illogical ideas never challenged. The result is they’re given their degrees, they don’t earn them through hard work and mental discipline, yet they’re convinced they’re smart. The reality is they’re still in kindergarten mentally and ranting on about boys versus girls as though this is a serious issue for an adult to have.

      • Verna
        January 19, 2013 at 8:02 am #

        The woman who said that to you, is an idiot.

      • January 22, 2013 at 12:57 am #

        Oh man, now I just feel an exceptional amount of second hand embarrassment knowing that you stole this pathetic line to use on Dr Phil today and he thought it was too pathetic to even dignify with a response. LOL @ U

    • April 26, 2012 at 2:43 pm #

      Ron, bloody well said. Wrapped up what Jason’s whole point was, very nicely. On a tangent, people get too offended these days. Who the fuck cares if you or I feel offended? It’s a feeling that only “you” control, so really, blaming anyone but yourself for saying something you find offensive is kind of petty in itself.

    • Kathy
      May 14, 2012 at 10:42 pm #

      A lion has no concept of right or wrong and survives on sheer instinct. Are you saying the same of yourself? Because if so, yes, you should be in a cage too.

      • May 15, 2012 at 9:26 am #

        Conversely, Kathy, do you believe that every man is a paragon of virtue and none would ever do harm to you? Should every man who isn’t be in a cage? Should every human being who gives into their baser instincts, man or woman (such as the woman who cut her husband’s phallus off and dropped it down a plughole, letting him bleed to death) should they be put in a cage?

        • Kathy
          May 18, 2012 at 3:10 am #

          Not at all. I’m saying nobody is perfect but every time we, as humans, do something, it’s because we made a sentient choice to do so. Nobody is either completely bad or completely good, we do bad things and good things based on judgement.

          And of course that woman should be locked up-she made a decision to kill! In what way could I possibly be expected to find that acceptable? Am I supposed to dance victoriously around his severed phallus, cackling like the big bad feminist I am?

          If I wasn’t very pro-base instincts I wouldn’t be a slut in the first place, obviously. The difference is that when I indulge my animal instincts they don’t hurt anybody. Unless they’re into that kind of thing.

    • LLLookAtYouHacker
      June 30, 2012 at 5:28 am #

      “I find so many of the arguments on this column so patently ridiculous as to be infantile. If I go for a walk in the Serengeti wearing Lady Gaga’s meat suit, im going to get my ass eaten. The fact that it is the Lions “fault” doesn’t negate the fact that I was an idiot.”

      Again, that’s a strawman situation. Rape can potentially occur anywhere and at anytime. Additionally many victims know the rapist at the time of the attack, Not all rapists are strangers waiting in dark alleyways. (Raises eyes.)

    • J
      September 17, 2012 at 10:45 pm #

      Bra-vo. Hit the nail on the head.

    • January 22, 2013 at 12:55 am #

      Good to know you don’t understand the difference between a lion and a man who has the cognitive ability to understand that rape is both illegal and immoral, meanwhile a lion has no such ability to differentiate between how “wrong” it would be to eat a human vs the choice to eat a gazelle. Oh, and that actually a lion has more self control than you give man credit for because a lion can coexist with other creatures without killing them and only does so for it’s survival. No man is raping to live. Who exactly is it here who doesn’t want to take responsibility for their own behavior? Oh, that’s right, THE RAPIST who makes the choice to actively hurt another person. Meanwhile the woman, who is not hurting anyone or even statistically more likely to be raped based off her dress is still to blame? I can’t even be assed to count the logical fallacies all over this comment section.

      • January 29, 2013 at 1:05 am #

        “Oh, and that actually a lion has more self control than you give man credit for because a lion can coexist with other creatures without killing them and only does so for it’s survival.”

        You are incorrect… First off, it has been well documented that lions can and do kill for reasons other than survival. Secondly, the original comparison was between 2 different forms of dangerous predators, lions and rapists… “Man” (or men, as a whole) do not need self control in order to keep themselves from raping, as they have no urge to rape. It is only the minority of social deviants who operate outside of the moral consensus who rape… And in that regard, they are rather similar to the lions in that, lions (or any predatory animal really) also operate outside of any kind human sense of morality.

  27. Evelin Olívia Fróes
    April 29, 2012 at 9:56 am #

    Sorry to say sluts have been praised by brazilian media. They are called periguetes and every periguete character that appears on brazilian soap operas became magazine covers like Veja for instance. These journalists say periguetes are desired by Brazilian men and they are the ideal woman who’s a role model every Brazilian woman should imitate. That’s a shame to me and a sadness too. That’s a relief to know not all men like sluts/periguetes, although I wish to know about it from my male compatriots.
    That post and comments are educational, all woman should learn from them.

  28. Em
    April 30, 2012 at 2:30 pm #

    I would just like to point out that there is a major flaw in your article and within several of the comments posted.

    What a woman is wearing has absolutely nothing to do with whether or not she will be sexually assaulted. Every major piece of research demonstrates this. Rapists prey on people based on their vulnerability. Reports show that there is no correlation between dressy like a ‘slut’ and being assaulted. Plus approximately 82% of rapes are committed by somebody known to the victim.

    http://www.rapecrisis.org.uk/commonmyths2.php
    http://www.aifs.gov.au/acssa/statistics.html
    http://www.rainn.org/statistics
    http://www.911rape.org/facts-quotes/statistics
    http://studentaffairs.depaul.edu/svss/usa/myths.html

    The list goes on……

    • April 30, 2012 at 4:13 pm #

      I would like to point out a major flaw in your comment, this article isn’t about rape, it’s about this idea that women are exempt from self-responsibility for their own safety, it most certainly is not saying that women are or should be raped because of how they dress.

      Quoting your own sources:

      “Women in the 18-24 year age bracket were more likely to be assaulted than women in other age-groups: 19% of women aged 18-24 had experienced sexual violence in the past 12 months, compared with 6.8% of women aged 35-44 and 1.2% of women aged 55 and over.”

      Younger women are targetted more often that older women. Wow. I’m sure I’ve said this before many times. What is it about younger women? Less worldly wise? Thinking they’re know-it-alls? Less likely to heed good advice? Dressing up for parties? In the sexual prime of their lives?

      The fact that 82% of female rape victims know their assailent doesn’t mean much. He might have been someone she went to school with all her life, but didn’t talk much to each other, they go out once and she got raped by him. It’s not a very useful piece of information at all really? Maybe he was just the boy who lived down the street? Or maybe most young women who get raped aren’t very good a taking care of themselves?

      “What a woman is wearing has absolutely nothing to do with whether or not she will be sexually assaulted. Every major piece of research demonstrates this.”

      Point to the lines, quote the paragraphs in the research, the primary research, that says this.

      • Andrew Beato
        May 1, 2012 at 12:29 am #

        I agree with Jason, I fail to see how the 82% statistic (someone she knows vs someone she doesn’t know) actually means anything in connection with this article, or Slutwalk, or how a woman dresses. Doe “they guy I was grinding up against in the club who I went home with” count as someone the girl knows?

      • E.C.
        May 2, 2012 at 4:56 am #

        “Younger women are targetted more often that older women. Wow. I’m sure I’ve said this before many times. What is it about younger women? Less worldly wise? Thinking they’re know-it-alls? Less likely to heed good advice? Dressing up for parties? In the sexual prime of their lives?”

        Obviously I’m speculating, but it could be because younger women are more likely to be out with friends and be in situations in which these things could occur, while older women may tend to spend time at home with families or just not go out as much. Also, at that age, girls are often away from home for the first time in their lives, just going to college. This is a big reason why there is a big emphasis on colleges doing prevention work. There are a lot of guys that know that the freshman girls are going to be easy targets. Again, let’s look at the perpetrators and why they’re committing these crimes as opposed to why it’s the victim’s fault that some asshole assaulted her. Perps look for VULNERABLE people, not sexually provocative people. Sexual assault is about power and control, not attraction.

        “The fact that 82% of female rape victims know their assailent doesn’t mean much. He might have been someone she went to school with all her life, but didn’t talk much to each other, they go out once and she got raped by him. It’s not a very useful piece of information at all really? Maybe he was just the boy who lived down the street? Or maybe most young women who get raped aren’t very good a taking care of themselves?”

        It means a lot. It means that the perps are usually people who the victim thought could be trusted. When they say that the victim knew someone, sometimes it may be a distant acquaintance, but often it’s a friend, an ex, current partner, family friend, etc. That is important because it shows that again how perps use their position as a trusted person to be able to attack when they are alone with the victim or the victim is in some other way vulnerable. Because of that, 60% of rapes are committed in a victim’s home. So you see, the norm isn’t some scantily dressed woman with lose morals picking up a random stranger here. It’s your everyday girl (sister, mother, aunt, friend) that it happens to, regardless of how she dresses.

        Also, did you know that most convicted rapists admit they don’t remember what the
        victim was wearing? It seems there may be one item that a victim could be wearing that perps would be interested in, though. In interviews with convicted rapists, many say they mostly look at the shoes of the victim to determine the ability to run away or fight back. Well, I guess I must just be begging to be raped if I leave my home in anything but running shoes, then.

        • May 2, 2012 at 10:08 am #

          I’m so tempted to say, “typical woman, obsessed with what people are wearing and completely missing their behaviour, yet another example of a woman objectifying women,” and leave it at that.

          Your first paragraph is basically the old line of “but women are helpless and meek and stupid and shouldn’t be given the responsibility of looking after themselves,” line that cracks me up everytime I hear a woman give this. So… women aren’t equal to men, is that what you want to say? Men should be looking after these poor defenseless brainless little girls? Fuck that shit. Looking after women is not my responsibility. Nor is it any man’s responsibility. If women want to be treated equally to men in dignity and rights then they have to accept the same responsibilities and challenges in life that men have to deal with.

          Besides, check your stats, men are four times more likely to be murdered and four times more likely to be violently assaulted than women. The women aren’t the primary victim group here.

          Your second paragraph is basically, “but women are too stupid to choose reliable and genuine friends to hang out with.” I’m getting sick and tired of your woman bashing here. We’re not talking about children here, we’re talking about grown up women. Women who can legally drive and drink alcohol. Women who are responsible for themselves and their own safety. If you’re going to continue advocating that women ought to be looked after by men, even when they’re adults, then you need to offer men something in exchange so it’s worthwhile to them. Like consideration, understanding, gratitude, respect, loyalty and honesty. I don’t see these words on the covers of many women’s magazines. Instead I see endless instructions on how to act and dress like a slut. Men don’t write those magazines.

          • May 2, 2012 at 11:17 pm #

            I don’t think E.C. realises the extent to which she’s creating meanings of her own behind the statistics. 82% of rapes being done by someone the victim knew, doesn’t extrapolate to “this means it’s someone who the victim thought could be trusted”. No…. that’s speculation. Additionally, 60% of rapes occurring in the victim’s home, is just as damning to those who argue for the victim’s ability to say no at any time and take her own responsibility not to lead herself into danger, instead of leading him back to her house to fuck (what else)

            My point is that drawing any conclusion around those statistics (are they actually verified percentages?) is just as much speculation, and as you can see by Jason and the other commenters here, E.C, what those statistics mean, can be drawn both ways. You’re obviously never going to see eye to eye, so why try to convert everyone to interpret the data your way?

            • E.C.
              May 3, 2012 at 7:49 am #

              I’m applying the statistics the real life cases I work with on a daily basis. That’s why I’ve interpreted them that way.

              • May 25, 2012 at 11:11 am #

                Understood. But 60% in the victim’s home? Surely that percentage is too high. I’m assuming that this happens when the victim trustingly takes a man back and invites him into her home after a night out, to stay the night, right? It sounds like it would be reasonable to educate women not to be so trusting. That in itself, would be taking more responsibility for their own safety, and I think that’s reasonable to everyone, right? End of story.

                • May 25, 2012 at 11:26 am #

                  My friend who is a social worker wrote a paper on the subject and can confirm the statistics. It’s not about the victim “inviting the man back for a one-night stand”, it’s more likely a male acquaintance whom she has no interest in, visiting as a friend, and forcing their way in. It could be the gardener, or the plumber who has been fixing the taps. Or it could be the man in the friend zone who can’t think of another way to get in bed with the woman.

                  So, dressing like a “slut” has very little to play in this.

                  After writing that paper my friend indeed has become a lot less trusting. She meets a man she must deal with (a deliveryman) on the doorstep and does not allow him into the house. She may meet him with the security screen closed as well.

            • January 22, 2013 at 1:16 am #

              “instead of leading him back to her house to fuck (what else)”

              That says a lot more about you than it does about these women. If you assume that men and women can only relate on a sexual level, and you assume, “Want to come over” means, “Want to fuck me?” you have a serious problem and a lack of understanding about consent and human relationships. And further, even if a woman does want to have sex at one point in the night, if, at any time, she changes her mind, feels uncomfortable, says no, it is HER RIGHT to make that call and it is rape if he presses on. This is a serious issue that needs to be addressed with so many people. You’re putting a whole lot of intention into the statistics in regards to situations you had no part in, and it’s very telling about your view of women and consent.

          • E.C.
            May 3, 2012 at 7:58 am #

            “Your first paragraph is basically the old line of “but women are helpless and meek and stupid and shouldn’t be given the responsibility of looking after themselves,” line that cracks me up everytime I hear a woman give this. So… women aren’t equal to men, is that what you want to say? Men should be looking after these poor defenseless brainless little girls? Fuck that shit. Looking after women is not my responsibility. Nor is it any man’s responsibility. If women want to be treated equally to men in dignity and rights then they have to accept the same responsibilities and challenges in life that men have to deal with.”

            Where in the paragraph did I say anything about men needing to protect women? I did not come near to insinuating that anywhere, nor did I say anything about women being are helpless, meek and stupid. I gave examples of why girls in that age group are likely targeted more often. Boys in that age group may not be targeted as often simply because men are only 10% of victims out of every 100. Your misunderstanding and misstating of what I said is incredible!

            “Besides, check your stats, men are four times more likely to be murdered and four times more likely to be violently assaulted than women. The women aren’t the primary victim group here.”

            I don’t need to check my stats, you need to understand them better. Men are certainly most often the perpetrators of any type of violent crime across the board and men are often the victims of violent crime, but they are a small percentage (10%) of sexual assaults specifically.

            In your last paragraph you, again, assert that I’m insulting women and saying there is a need for protection from men when, again, I said nothing of the sort. Rather, I’m saying that men that rape SHOULD NOT RAPE WOMEN. That’s not the same as asking them for protection. I’m not saying that women don’t know how to pick friends, I’m saying that men shouldn’t act like a friend and then rape a woman when she begins to trust him. These guys don’t just come up and say, “Hi, I’m a rapist. Would you like to be my friend?”

          • January 22, 2013 at 1:10 am #

            You and the point are just never gonna meet are you?

            Same bullshit victim blaming could be said for all these men who you claim have had things like “paternity fraud” committed against them. They should’ve been able to predict that behavior in their partner. Only you can’t always do that. Sorry bro. It’s not that simple and you trying to claim that it is only shows your desperation to peg women as responsible and hold men unaccountable for the actions that men commit against them. People lie and manipulate, this is something that happens all the time. If people could see through that nobody would ever be lied to. Ever heard of the wolf in sheep’s clothing? Luckily for us though, you’re a wolf in wolf’s clothing, so at the very least women can google your name to see how much you love to defend rapists while blaming women for their rapes. Hopefully at least in your case women can make the “grown up” decision and choose to avoid you at all costs because your position as a psycho is laid out right before them. Let’s just hope you’re not one of those cowards using a fake name to spew their misogyny.

        • May 2, 2012 at 11:10 pm #

          EC, This is a big reason why there is a big emphasis on colleges doing prevention work. – Can you explain what this prevention work is, and if you’re for or against it?

          • E.C.
            May 3, 2012 at 8:04 am #

            A lot of campuses have departments that focus on sexual assault, intimate partner violence and other issues that have typically been looked at as “women’s issues.” These office may provide counseling, referrals and other services to students that come to them with such problems. Also, many schools participate on task forces to address these issues and have protocols with law enforcement and agencies that serve victims to address crisis situations. Special training may be provided to campus staff and police to help address handling of these issues.

            Take Back the Night is an event that many campuses do. The activities planned for these events may vary, but typically they’re aimed at bringing awareness to the issue, help victims come forward to get help if needed and send a message to all the students that sexual assault is an issue that such behavior is unacceptable and is taken seriously at the school.

            Teachers of certain courses may allow a trainer to come speak to classes about sexual assault, how a person can try to be safer, how to help others that may be victims and where to get help if you are a victim.

            I think a lot of this is helpful. There is more activity being done now to address violence and such at younger ages now, which I think is very important as well.

            • May 3, 2012 at 5:16 pm #

              “how a person can try to be safer, how to help others that may be victims” What would this “preventative” advice be?

  29. E.C.
    May 2, 2012 at 3:11 am #

    I don’t have time to read all the comments, but I read some of the blog post and I a few of the comments. A few points:

    1. Most victims of sexual assault are wearing jeans and a t-shirt at the time of the assault. Dressing like a “slut” has nothing to do with whether or not a woman is raped. Women that wear burkas get raped, too.

    2. Most assaults are committed by someone the victim knows. It isn’t usually some random guy at a bar that saw a provocatively dressed woman and said, “She really looks like a slut and I just can’t control myself because she’s turning me on in that slut outfit, so I am going to rape her.” One of the reasons a lot of rapes are committed by acquaintances, friends, lovers, etc. is that the perpetrator has gained the victim’s trust and is able to commit the assault when the victim is vulnerable – alone with the perp, drunk, etc.

    3. Sexual assault is about power and control, not about sex! Perpetrators don’t assault their victims because they were too turned on to stop themselves, they do it because it gives them a sense of power over their victim.

    4. You may think that the slutwalk is just about a reaction to one man saying something, but it is a reaction to the larger societal view that sexually active women should be punished. His comment implies that some women are asking to be raped because they dress in a way that would make her appear sexually promiscuous and undeserving of respect. The word “slut” connotes a woman that has slept around and is worth less than a woman who only gives it up to her husband/boyfriend/man. Let’s face it – people don’t automatically think of a guy who has had various sexual partners when this word is used. It’s an insulting word for a woman, just like the word spic would be insulting to someone of Latino background. It’s a generalization with a negative connotation.

    The constable may have simply been giving what he thought was very important and sound advice. It just shows how little we, as a society, understand sexual assault.

    We are still putting the blame on the victims and always trying to see what it is that the victim did to deserve to be raped when we need to be focusing on the perpetrators and why they rape. The Slutwalk is a way of trying to bring awareness to that fact that a woman does not deserve to be raped, even if it looks like she may be dressed to attract sexual attention. You have, somehow, completely managed not to see that, though.

    • May 2, 2012 at 10:49 am #

      1. How the Hell do you know this? Is there a justice department report on rape victim clothing choices? Can we compare how many women in Burkas got raped to how many women in hot pants?

      2. Again. Why is this relevant? All I’m hearing is, “WATCH OUT! ALL MEN ARE POTENTIAL RAPISTS!!!!” which is just underhanded fear mongering to try and prejudice the audience. All women are potential murderers. You can’t argue against that comment, but it’s as meaningless as the idea that all men are rapists. The fact is very few men are rapists and the vast majority of men actively act to prevent rape, or to punish rapists. Most men are potential saviours of women from being raped is more relevant.

      3. Evidence please. Primary research articles. This is just a myth. Women in their early 20s are the most physically strong and social women with the most number of protective people around them yet they are the largest group of rape victims. It ain’t because it’s easy to rape these women. It’s because they’re in their sexual prime. It takes a lot of over thinking to ignore such common sense.

      4. Again. Evidence of this larger societal view. Frankly my eyes and my ears tell me it doesn’t exist. Everything else you’ve mentioned I’ve commented on earlier and refuted.

      Blaming the victim? Now there’s another fantasy. If we really were blaming the victim, we’d honour kill her or throw her into prison. Neither of those happen in Western countries, instead she has a preponderance of rape counseling services available to her. Victim blaming of rape victims just doesn’t happen. The rapist is the one who is always blamed. Get a grip on reality please.

      • LLLookAtYouHacker
        June 30, 2012 at 2:15 am #

        “Victim blaming of rape victims just doesn’t happen. The rapist is the one who is always blamed. Get a grip on reality please.”

        Please, please, please tell me you’re joking. In fact don’t tell, i’d rather live in blissful ignorance. No-one could be that misinformed. Jesus christ.

      • Verna
        January 19, 2013 at 8:04 am #

        Anyone with a brain knows that rape isn’t about sex. It’s about controlling women, just like you are.

  30. Kathy
    May 4, 2012 at 12:24 am #

    Hi Jason. First off I am what you would call a slut-I shall get that out there. I’ve enjoyed sex with a lot of men and plan to continue to do so, whether it be in a relationship, casual, a one-off or long-term. I also use contraception, have never had an STD (touch wood, har har) and have never been tempted to commit paternity fraud. Hi!

    I wear low-cut tops when I go out looking to meet men, and am never surprised when this results in more attention than usual, because that is precisely what I am aiming for. I am always flattered when a guy starts talking to me or asking to buy me a drink and always polite in my response. Sometimes it’s ‘yes, please’ and sometimes it’s ‘no, thanks.’ But if a guy persists after I’ve turned him down, that is precisely when it becomes a problem because he is not listening to the words coming out of my mouth. If I’ve dressed revealingly, he can reasonably deduce that I am looking to meet someone. However, he cannot take it for granted that ‘someone’ automatically means ‘him’. Just because he likes me, doesn’t mean the feeling is mutual, and just because I’ve made parts of my body public by exposing them, does not mean they’re public property. He has no right to my body.

    Likewise, just because I see a guy I like the look of, I don’t presume that he will be attracted to me, no matter how tight his shirt is or how much cologne he is wearing. If he gave me the brush-off I would take it with dignity, respect his decision, walk away and have a good night regardless. I can understand that when this happens, it is a blow-but nobody has a right to not be sexually rejected.

    At the end of the day, I am 1. breaking no laws and 2. harming nobody when I dress revealingly, and as sexy as I am, I refuse to believe that a guy could see me dancing in a tight, low-cut, silky dress and actually lose the ability to control himself. If a man (or woman!) rapes, it’s their decision. There is always a moment when they make that choice, because it IS a CHOICE. And if one person makes a choice to rape, and the other does not make a choice to be raped, then the question of ‘personal responsibility’ for victims becomes moot.

    Don’t get me wrong, I can see where you’re coming from when you talk about personal responsibility-it’s just that the further you tread that path, the more dangerous it becomes. A woman dressing provocatively is more likely to be raped, so it follows that a woman who dresses provactively and was aware of this fact has some culpability. But where does that stop? It can only follow that we must dress at all times with male reactions in mind. Slut shaming is the ultimate avoidance of responsibility. A woman who dresses revealingly is more likely to be raped, yes, but what people seem to forget is that that doesn’t make the rapist right, in the same way that one is more likely to be robbed if they leave their door unlocked. That rape is always, always wrong, and if a woman says ‘no’ then there is absolutely no reason to think that she means yes. Or at least there shouldn’t be-I’m aware of a dangerous view of ‘romance’ being men chasing women who state repeatedly that they’re not interested only to win them over, a view held by many women, but that’s a discussion for another time.

    • May 13, 2012 at 7:39 am #

      One in four American women carry an STD, many don’t even know they do. This all happened after the 1960s when STDs went from decades of being rare to affecting just about every family. So you’re a lucky slut, so far, but your companions have a lot to answer for.

      A lot of what you said, I said in my article.

      But generally, I don’t understand why you’ve just spent so much time talking about yourself.

      Also, just because something is legal, doesn’t mean it isn’t wrong.

      • Kathy
        May 14, 2012 at 7:59 pm #

        What exactly do my companions have to answer for? I have always engaged in safe sex and get regular check-ups. And for every slut that gets infected, there is a guy out there who is equally to blame.

        Also, I introduced myself and gave a brief background addressing some of the accusations you’ve made to women either in your post or comments. That’s the extent of what I said about myself that can’t be applied to the vast majority of proud, sexually active women. There’s no need to be rude.

        And what exactly are you referring to when you say ‘just because something is legal, doesn’t mean it isn’t wrong’? I have a sinking suspicion you’re referring to showing some cleavage but don’t want to do you the dishonour of presuming such.

        • May 14, 2012 at 8:37 pm #

          “And for every slut that gets infected, there is a guy out there who is equally to blame.”

          Absolutely, but as I’ve said before, men don’t go around creating slutwalks and dressing provocatively to get attention and then guilt tripping people for looking at them… unless they’re gay… well a lot of homosexual men hate those men for doing that and I’ve got plans to write about that.

          The thing is, I never feel the need to introduce myself before talking about a topic in any of my articles. I’ve written easily 50,000 words on this website, but you’d learn about as much about me and my personal life from all that as I did from your one comment.

          Why? Because I write about issues, not myself.

          “And what exactly are you referring to when you say ‘just because something is legal, doesn’t mean it isn’t wrong’? I have a sinking suspicion you’re referring to showing some cleavage but don’t want to do you the dishonour of presuming such.”

          *facepalm*

          NO! I was thinking: it isn’t illegal to lie, but it is still wrong to lie.

          • Kathy
            May 14, 2012 at 8:52 pm #

            Well you know how your point is how a woman should hold some responsibility for her attack? I would have thought you’d approve, given that my intention with my introduction was to pre-emptively address all the issues that it’s possible that other commenters of the same mind as yourself would throw at me.

            And nowhere in Slutwalk does it say that men should be ashamed for looking at women. What they should be ashamed of is sexual harassment and assault. And given that the vast majority of men would never consider doing either of those, I don’t see why a man who’s not a rapist or sexual offender could have a problem with it.

            And where did I say that I, or other sluts,think it’s okay to lie?

    • May 25, 2012 at 11:03 am #

      A skilful and pointed reply. Well written and I agree with you.

    • Evelyn
      June 22, 2012 at 7:16 pm #

      Kathy, after reading all your posts and after this one in particular, I feel very very sorry for you – and women like you. Not sorry in the way of sympathy but sorry in the sense that I find you incredibly pathetic. It’s no wonder you keep finding a need to defend this silly Slutwalk cause and argue with Jason on every single thing he says. Describing.. advertising?yourself like that and being very proud of it shows something about your character and priorities. You are very deserving of a slut badge of honour or that word tatooed on your forehead – serious. My advice? divine intervention. OR. That long-overdue head-check is in order. And while you are at it, an STD checkup too – that is so totally waiting to happen.

      • LLLookAtYouHacker
        June 30, 2012 at 2:28 am #

        Thank you for acting as a personification of everything that is wrong with slut-shaming. The truly saddening thing is you probably thought your response was one of nobility.

        Catastrophic.

      • Kathy
        July 18, 2012 at 11:52 pm #

        Hi, Evelyn. I’d like to thank you for this post, because sometimes I look at myself and I wonder whether I’m doing it right. I worry about my weight, even though it’s healthy and normal. I like being spanked. I like wearing heels. I get my eyebrows done, even though it hurts like hell.

        So I do all this stuff and think to myself, maybe I’m not so deserving of the word ‘feminist’. Sometimes I worry about what other feminists (the real, grown-up ones) will think of me.

        But then you-sweet, wonderful you-come along, with your out-of-date opinions and your decade-old insults with no factual backup, and I’ve so clearly got under your skin, and I think, yeah. I’m doing it right.

        So thanks for your concern, but my head and my cunt are in good working order. I feel bad for you, actually, that you’re quoting opinions you’ve been spoon-fed and you’re just too close-minded to realise that one day, your granddaughters will be ashamed for being descended from someone so…ridiculous.

  31. Anonymous
    May 5, 2012 at 8:08 pm #

    Ron Meyer should write articles for Intentious, he would get my votes.

    Jason as usual a truly great article well done, keep it up and sometimes you just have to be an outspoken asshole to get the points across.

    • May 7, 2012 at 9:01 pm #

      Maybe he should! If Ron’s interested, contact us 🙂

  32. May 12, 2012 at 12:08 am #

    “They are effectively saying that men, not women, are responsible for protecting and keeping women safe which is chauvinist to the stratosphere.”

    I call bullshit. If I rob your house it’s not your fault I robbed you. If I shoot you in the street it’s not your fault I shot you and if I raped you ANYWHERE it’s not your fault I raped you. It’s not chauvanistic, it’s common sense.

    • May 13, 2012 at 7:33 am #

      So, “fault” has what to do with responsibility to look after yourself?

      It’s chauvanistic because the claim is that women aren’t mature enough to take of themselves so they need a man to do it for them. Poor pathetic creatures! In fact a lot of the comments here are starting to make me think that lots of wimen do need men to reign them in hard back to reality.

      • May 13, 2012 at 7:38 am #

        If it’s women’s responsibility to “look after themselves” in this case. That is, to prevent rape, then why isn’t it your responsibility to “look after yourself” and prevent your house from being burglarized or “look after yourself” and keep from being murdered? The plain fact is that rapists rape not based on clothing, and not based on the woman, but because they can. Because they feel that the woman’s consent is unimportant.

        Clothing does not give consent. Alcohol doesn’t give consent. Drugs don’t give consent. Only active, informed consent is permissible for your lawyer, or for your doctor, or for your lover. Rapists don’t care about that. Real men do.

        • May 13, 2012 at 7:52 am #

          “real men” What’s a real man?

          You’re completely wrong. If you don’t lock and secure your house against fire and theft the insurance company are going to give you fuck all. It’s your responsibility to look after your stuff and only when it falls outside your human ability to do so does one get compensation.

          Furthermore, if one screams and rants at someone in the street and this person punches one in the face, don’t expect the cops to give a damn. Maybe it should be the same with rape?

          You’re making a demand for female privilege.

          • May 13, 2012 at 8:07 am #

            So if a 240 pound man forces himself on a 120 pound man or woman, she should only be able to claim rape if she resists until what, he punches her? He breaks a bone? Knocks her unconscious? Kills her? Where should we draw the line? What about a girl who is drugged? What if she’s outnumbered 4 to 1 or worse? Does she still have a duty to defend herself?

            Locking a door to prevent theft applies to rape how exactly? Let’s use a better example. If I force you to the ground and start to go through your pockets to rob you, and you don’t resists, you must have wanted me to take your money! We already don’t operate like this. Banks are under instructions to NOT resist most robbery attempts, as are most retail establishments to prevent greater crimes from taking place.

            Where am I making a demand for privilege? The only “demand” I make is that consent be the only thing that gives consent. “No means no” is flawed. “Yes means Yes” is the point.

            • May 13, 2012 at 8:14 am #

              Surely you’re trolling? You did understand what I wrote?

              All the examples you used are irrelevant, because they were instants of unprovoked assault and lacking context.

              For example, is it right to belt a mother over the head with a hammer? If she about to throw a baby over a bridge then, yes, it is the right thing to do.

              See. Context. It matters.

              There was a great comment by someone here about lady gaga and a meat suit. Read it.

              • May 13, 2012 at 8:18 am #

                Context does matter. A man robbing a house is committing a property crime. A man raping a woman is committing a crime against a person. If I rob you and you don’t resist I’ve still robbed you. If I rape you and you don’t resist, guess what. I’ve still raped you. Sorry you didn’t comprehend that the first time around. Or could you just not find a good counter-argument?

                • May 13, 2012 at 8:22 am #

                  I understood what you wrote, I just didn’t see any relationship to the topic.

                  Resisting being raped is not the same thing as dressing like a slut, acting like a slut or hanging around dodgy thugs.

                  Also, regarding privilege.

                  Which sex would you rather be? Male or female?

                  • May 13, 2012 at 8:26 am #

                    Allow me to quote you “Furthermore, if one screams and rants at someone in the street and this person punches one in the face, don’t expect the cops to give a damn. Maybe it should be the same with rape?” That is what I was responding to.

                    • May 13, 2012 at 8:41 am #

                      You’re going to have to be more specific, I still don’t get what you mean. I was pointing out that irresponsible behavior gets negative consequences. I honestly don’t see why one should protect irresponsible behavior from it’s naturally negative consequences. That’s demanding privilege.

                      It all seems to come down to this airy-fairy idea that “violence should never happen.” But let’s be honest, without the threat of violence, people would all act like and turn out as annoying spoiled brats. The arrest and detention is a form of violence remember. Violence has a very important and stabilising effect in society. Violence means lazy annoying bums don’t reach epidemic proportions so as to drag society down into a pit of narcissist maliase.

                      To a certain extent, the precise and reasonable application of violence is what separates a civilian and a barbarian. Not the absence of violence at all. Only slaves never use or consider using violence. Let’s face it, feminists want men so demoralised with shame and guilt for imaginary gender crimes that they cannot effectively stand up for themselves and become slaves to women. I don’t have any romantic vision of women, they’re the same human beings as men, just as flawed and wretched.

                    • May 13, 2012 at 9:10 am #

                      Ok I literally cannot reply to that thread anymore so starting a new one. You said that “if one screams and rants at someone in the street and this person punches one in the face, don’t expect the cops to give a damn. Maybe it should be the same with rape?”

                      I responded with ” if a 240 pound man forces himself on a 120 pound man or woman, she should only be able to claim rape if she resists until what, he punches her? He breaks a bone? Knocks her unconscious? Kills her? Where should we draw the line? What about a girl who is drugged? What if she’s outnumbered 4 to 1 or worse? Does she still have a duty to defend herself?”

                      I don’t see the huge leap in logic. You say that women are responsible for preventing rape. I say that has to be a VERY carefully qualified statement. You imply that slutty clothing causes rape. Clothing doesn’t dictate behavior, it might imply it, but implication is not consent. You ask me what a “Real Man” is. I say a real man is someone who knows what consent is. Consent is your partner saying “yes” when you ask her without pressure if she wants to have sex. Not assuming that a drunk girl grinding on you in the club wants to jump you.

                      You say women shouldn’t have additional privileges, I say fine. We don’t blame the victims of murder for being murdered. Let’s not blame the victims of rape for being raped.

                      You say context matters in response to me talking about your comments comparing house-breaking to rape. I agreed. House-breaking is a property crime. Rape is a violent crime against a person. People aren’t property.

                      Finally let’s look at this statement. “Violence has a very important and stabilising effect in society. Violence means lazy annoying bums don’t reach epidemic proportions so as to drag society down into a pit of narcissist maliase.”

                      Violence is instability. Violence is a breakdown in social order. More violent places are, almost by definition, less civilized. By your measure Iraq is infinitely preferable to America because “lazy annoying bums don’t reach epidemic proportions” because they haven’t “drag[ed] society down into a pit of narcissistic malaise” Problem is, after two trips there I noticed Iraq’s problems with violence stemmed from people who WERE lazy and WERE narcissistic. What makes us a better country isn’t our violence, it’s the fact that we seek meaning from conflict, without resorting to out and out violence, and those who do commit unnecessary violence are punished, not celebrated.

                      You even admit as much in your next statement “To a certain extent, the precise and reasonable application of violence is what separates a civilian and a barbarian. Not the absence of violence at all.” Here’s the kicker. Rape is never a “reasonable application of violence.” It is an abhorrent crime where one person violates another in the most intimate way possible without regard to their wishes.

                      Slutwalk is not about exempting women from responsibility. It’s about assigning responsibility for rape on the rapist where it belongs. A woman wearing a tiny skirt grinding on a guy doesn’t deserve to be raped. Depending on your outlook she might deserve anything from free drinks to contempt. She doesn’t deserve an emotionally scarring, life-changing event because she wanted to go out and feel great about how she looked. In this case the use of force GREATLY exceeded any “crime” and blaming her is like blaming a murder victim for not getting out of the way of a bullet.

                    • May 13, 2012 at 9:29 am #

                      I really cannot follow your logic. It leaps and jumps and twirls around the place. You’re linking things together that don’t go. Like responsibility and defending yourself. These are different things but you’ve turned one into the other without noticing much less explaining why.

                      I didn’t say women were responsible for preventing rape. You’re full of it.

                      I said women are responsible for taking care of their own safety as far as it is humanly possible. As someone said in a previous comment, wearing lady gaga’s meat suit, walking into a lion’s cage and then complaining about being eaten by the lion is just not rational. I also said men aren’t under any obligation to stop rape. But they do. Stop spreading this hateful idea that all men are rapists just because a few freaks are.

                      Honestly, I’m at the point here where I feel you need a class in epistemology and the value of semantics. Because you make knowledge claims without justification and twist the meanings of words to suit your prejudices.

                    • May 13, 2012 at 9:34 am #

                      You linked them Jason. you said It shouldn’t be counted as rape if a woman failed to fight back. I said that we don’t use that standard in any other person on person crime.

                      For the Lady Gaga example: Men aren’t lions. Men are rational beings who are responsible for their own behavior. So are women. Women choose to wear alluring clothing to attract men. This is hardly objectionable behavior. Some men take that as a license to rape. That is objectionable behavior. But clearly I’m the prejudiced one for thinking that men should have more self-control than lions.

                    • May 14, 2012 at 5:35 pm #

                      isn’t it your responsibility to “look after yourself” and prevent your house from being burglarized or “look after yourself” and keep from being murdered?

                      Yes. It is the responsibility of the potential victim to take steps to minimise their risk profile. It still puts the blame for an attack on the perpetrator, but the victim needs to take responsibility as well for their own safety. If I do not take reasonable steps to secure my household, for example, isn’t it fair to say that I was negligent in doing everything possible to prevent myself from getting robbed?

                      Being unable to point that out smacks of horrendous overindulgence in political correctness.

                      This is from someone who thinks slut shaming is stupid.

                    • May 14, 2012 at 7:13 pm #

                      “You linked them Jason. you said It shouldn’t be counted as rape if a woman failed to fight back.”

                      I am going to prescribe chlorpromazine for you, and if you continue to experience these hallucinations get back to me.

                • May 14, 2012 at 5:39 pm #

                  If I rape you and you don’t resist, guess what. I’ve still raped you

                  Take a step back. You should be spacially aware enough not to walk down dark allies, not to wear provocative clothing, not to increase your risk profile. Getting raped is the fault of the perpetrator but the victim needs to take responsibility in part for the prevention. It is common sense.

                  I do not walk down dark alleys with my laptop bag and my bling. If I get mugged walking down that dark alley, it is the robber’s fault, but that doesn’t change the fact I’ve been robbed. It is up to me to take responsibility for reducing my risk profile by taking another route or making other arrangements.

                  • LLLookAtYouHacker
                    June 30, 2012 at 4:17 am #

                    “Take a step back. You should be spacially aware enough not to walk down dark allies.“

                    Predictable, conformist perceptions of rape situations. People have been raped in the work-place; in their own homes; by close friends/family relatives… rape can potentially occur anywhere.

                    “Provocative clothing, not to increase your risk profile.”

                    The perception that all rapes are committed out of mere lust is derivative and predictable; the stimulants/circumstances of rape are infinite and ever-growing.

                    Creating such fantasised standards will not utterly protect you from rape.

                    • June 30, 2012 at 5:43 pm #

                      That travel agent woman who was robbed and stabbed to death in Thailand this month? Lots of people have been saying she was irresponsibly ignorant to be walking down a dark unknown street at 1am in the morning just assuming she’d be safe. When people say that sort of thing, why wouldn’t you agree? Do you see a “common sense” link between *some* potential instances of rape and some potential instances of murder? Sure, exercising common sense doesn’t garantee violent crimes will no longer happen, but it sure does reduce the percentage a little.

                    • Richard Lee
                      July 1, 2012 at 10:52 am #

                      You ignore my other comments where I have pointed out (from my social worker friend) that rape is more likely to occur through a visitor to your home with whom you are familiar with. This is a point I have acknowledged.

                      You are still be blinded by the “horrendousness” of rape. As I’ve explained before, rape is indeed a horrendous crime but the prevention of it is very similar to other violent assaults. So, even if you’re less likely to be raped getting wobbly on a night out than by your deranged uncle, it is still better to be safe on your nights out to minimize your overall risk profile. One does not preclude the other.

                      Creating such fantasised standards will not utterly protect you from rape.

                      Does dressing more sensibly increase or decrease your probability of being raped?

                      I’d say, even if it’s a minimal 2% decrease, stacking it upon several other countermeasures (such as not going down dark alleys at night, travelling with friends, not getting drunk) will significantly decrease the chance of violent assault, including rape.

  33. Chris Porter
    May 13, 2012 at 7:57 am #

    You don’t get laid very much do you?

    • May 13, 2012 at 8:00 am #

      Too stupid to think, so you use insults.

      lol.

      Yes Chris, you are a better person than me because you grovel at women’s feet. All hail the cosmic vagina! Giver of male dignity and worth!

      • Verna
        January 26, 2013 at 10:27 am #

        Why are you so down on women Jason? We can’t help it you’re sexually repulsive.

  34. Helen
    May 14, 2012 at 4:36 pm #

    This is a brilliantly satirical piece. Thanks so much! Haven’t laughed so hard for ages…

    • May 14, 2012 at 7:10 pm #

      That’s right, keep laughing, just keep laughing… it won’t be long before you’re 40. 😉

      • Kathy
        May 14, 2012 at 8:41 pm #

        Why is that relevant?

        • May 14, 2012 at 10:40 pm #

          Women in their 20s often get drunk off their sexual power because men are falling over themselves to please even a rude, selfish, greedy slut so long as she’s half attractive.

          The only reason why men talk to rude women is because they want to fuck them.

          Since feminists know everything, they won’t listen to sage advice from their elders telling them that this is the reality of the world and that their slutty behaviour will not be tolerated or accepted by men with half a glass of self-respect or after they’ve regained control of their senses post puberty.

          Honestly, I’m appalled with men for being this way, and believe me, I’m working hard to make sure that in the future boys will mature faster and stop worshipping cleavage and pussy. Are you going to do anything about immature women?

          • Kathy
            May 14, 2012 at 11:02 pm #

            Yes, I am. See my comment regarding enthusiastic consent and the importance thereof, something I’ve pushed in many directions. I do not believe women get to sit back and wait for everything in life to come to them. If they want something, they should show it. And if they don’t, or play games, they should expect not to get it. Same goes for men.

            And yes, some women do get ‘drunk’, as you say, off of that sexual power. I still don’t see how this is relevant to the comment that the author made regarding your work being satire. Are you saying to her that her opinion isn’t valid until she’s old enough (40, by your standards) to not be drunk on her own sexual power? In which case, are you saying that all female (I note you said ‘women’, not ‘some women’) opinions are invalid until they’ve reached 40 years of age?

            I agree that if a woman is rude, selfish and greedy because she’s expecting you to fawn over her attractiveness you shouldn’t give her the time of day-both out of principle and because she’s likely to be a vapid person who will refuse to compromise or make any effort towards your happiness within the relationship. Sure, I like being told I’m hot, but I’ll say it back at least as much.

            And I don’t see this link you keep drawing between female sluttiness and male self-respect. I treat everyone I meet, male, female or other, with respect until their actions warrant otherwise.

  35. May 14, 2012 at 5:11 pm #

    Why are women charged with more responsibility to “not be a slut” or dress/act in a way that you deem slutty than men are to not act violently towards women?

    I agree that we don’t live in a world where it’s advisable for women to dress provocatively and expect to not be treated differently by men because of it, whether that is expressed in a subtle glance at her breasts or a rape. But why are women charged with the task of amending their behaviours to cater to the most potentially-violent sexual predator before men are educated about NOT RAPING WOMEN? I have seen self defence courses offered to girls in high schools but never a seminar offered to boys about changing their attitudes towards women and educating them about respect.

    I am not calling all men potential rapists. I am not equating flirting with sexual harassment. But I DO think that it’s irresponsible for a police officer in a position of authority and as part of the legal system to encourage the attitude of blaming the victims of sexual abuse/harassment.

    That view is offensive to men as well, since it depicts them as mindless slaves to their cocks who simply can’t resist slamming it into someone who shows a bit of cleavage.

    • May 14, 2012 at 7:08 pm #

      Again, the education systems of the West are failing miserably.

      “Why are women charged with more responsibility to “not be a slut” or dress/act in a way that you deem slutty than men are to not act violently towards women?”

      I explained this, I apologise that I didn’t realise you couldn’t read English.

      “But why are women charged with the task of amending their behaviours to cater to the most potentially-violent sexual predator before men are educated about NOT RAPING WOMEN?”

      “I am not calling all men potential rapists.”

      Yeah, and I’m a monkey’s aunt. If you’re not going to think before posting, then at least proof-read please, because stupidity on this scale isn’t just embarassing for you, it’s a warning to intelligent alien life forms from outer space to stay away from this planet.

      • Lo
        May 16, 2012 at 3:36 am #

        But you earlier compared “all men are potential rapists” to “all women are potential murderers.” Isn’t this why we stress empathy among children – to teach them not to be murderers? Why is it wrong to suggest that we do the same concerning rape, regardless of a person’s gender?

        Would it not be good for the individual to stress self-control and self-autonomy?
        Say what you will about minimizing risk factors, that is another aspect that I’m not trying to discuss at the moment (and I mean that with no disrespect); but why not teach that it is wrong to hurt another person in the first place? When we teach primarily that a victim should have done XYZ, rather than not to violate other people, does that not create an atmosphere where it becomes increasingly easy to say that a victim somehow “deserved” it?

        Sure, I am an idealist; but without ideals, we’re merely stuck in place. Teaching people about their sexuality and how to talk about consent would be a good place to start in lowering the incidence of rape, and making sure that there is no confusion on the matter.

      • LLLookAtYouHacker
        June 30, 2012 at 2:39 am #

        All I see are ad-hominems.

  36. Stuart
    May 14, 2012 at 6:21 pm #

    You mate, are a complete tool. I just hope you never have the chance to have children because the way you’d bring up daughters would be just repulsive. You perpetuate the ‘women are to blame for rape’ stereo type. Go back top your cave, and don’t come out.

  37. May 14, 2012 at 8:45 pm #

    Thanks for everyone’s interest in this article, my computer is starting to struggle with loading this page and I’m struggling to find all the comments to reply to. I feel considering the great interest people have in this topic I should write a follow up article. I’ll do my best to answer as many points as possible.

  38. May 14, 2012 at 10:05 pm #

    ‘if you are a slut you should be ashamed of yourself’…actually, you should be ashamed of yourself Jason, for writing such a rubbish article. This is completely irresponsible. Women have the right, just as men do, to sleep with WHOEVER they want to, it’s not 1940 anymore. While you were busy clubbing women over the head, a thing called women’s liberation happened.

    • May 14, 2012 at 10:25 pm #

      “you should be ashamed of yourself Jason”

      But I’m not.

      Allow me to quote myself:

      “I really think you don’t understand me on this. I don’t feel responsible for women’s hurt feelings. I have no interest in protecting women’s feelings. I don’t get anything out of sucking up to women to make them feel special. I only feel responsible to me, my feelings and my needs.”

      • May 14, 2012 at 10:55 pm #

        It doesn’t surprise me that you’re not. Your article is stupid and irresponsible. I wouldn’t expect someone like you to be embarrassed by the stupidity of your writing. No woman deserves, encourages, or wants to be raped, despite what you believe. We shouldn’t be forced to dress ‘modestly’ just in case a man can’t help himself and rape our ‘attention seeking’ selves. The reality is, RAPISTS are responsible for rape, no one else.

        • May 16, 2012 at 10:11 am #

          Again, you seem to have this fanciful idea that I should care about someone else’s feelings.

          Again, we’re not talking about rapists, and if we’re talking about sluts, I apologise that I didn’t realise how your poor comprehension skill would leave you so confused.

          On the topic of rapists, yes, you’re right whether the rapists are male or female. However, it doesn’t discredit my argument at all though.

          • May 17, 2012 at 4:16 pm #

            You discredit your argument all by yourself, by presenting a misogynistic rant on ‘sluts’, it is a moronic opinion piece, nothing more. Thank goodness for citizen journalism, chauvinists like you can now rant to your hearts content, without an editor looking at the garbage you have presented and deciding, wisely, that such an under researched, innapropriate article is an embarrassment.

            In response to your comment ‘whether rapists are male or female’, be realistic here. Yes, a small percentage of men are raped by women, but statistics show male-female rape is much higher, as it is (in most cases) physically easier for a male to restrain a woman and penetrate her than it would be for a female to hold a man down against his will, and get him sexually aroused at the same time.

            Additionally, are you implying that if a male was to go out in a tight, muscle baring t-shirt, or be running in shorts without a shirt, that he is responsible for any attention he gets (wanted and unwanted) simply because he chose to wear something that, in someone else’s SUBJECTIVE OPINION, means he must be dressing that way for the attention?

            Who defines what a slut is, Jason? You seem to be an expert at the recognition of ‘sluts’, so enlighten me. Just because a woman dresses, in someone else’s opinion, ‘provocatively’, it does not make her a ‘slut’. If you are defining this by number of sexual partners, at what number do you suggest is not ok? Also, under what circumstance, for example- a woman with 5 sexual partners who were all casual encounters, or a woman who has had 15 partners, all longer term? Does the same rule apply to men? And what about cultural differences, for example, in some countries it is custom for women to dress conservatively, if a male moves to a country where women enjoy the right to wear whatever they like, can he use that as an excuse if he rapes a woman? No. No amount of justification can excuse rape, no excuse makes it ok, and no victim should ever be made to feel it is their fault.

            I don’t expect you to see the logic here, with your mind clouded by all this hatred for women, so I’ll spell it out for you. CALLING SOMEONE A ‘SLUT’ IS A SUBJECTIVE CONCEPT, THEREFORE WHAT YOU MAY THINK IS SLUTTY MAY NOT BE FOR THE NEXT PERSON. You irresponsibly say there is ‘nobility in slut-shaming’, but why does any woman have to be ashamed of who she sleeps with, or have this open to scrutiny and judgement by anyone else?

            You suggest that ‘sluts’ spread STD’s, but here’s reality- unprotected sex spreads STD’s, did you not attend school? In relation to pregnancy- a man should also take responsibility for what he does with his penis- if a man was to have unprotected sex with multiple women, he is just as stupid as she would be, doing the same thing, and in case you didn’t know, a woman can’t get pregnant without sperm, so how about placing some responsibility on men, too? If condom’s are used, the risk of spreading STD’s is minimal compared to unprotected sex. So next time you go to blame ‘sluts’ for spreading STD’s, maybe you will remember that MALE AND FEMALE idiots not using condoms outside of monogamous relationships is actually the biggest cause of STD’s being passed on. And, if you actually researched your facts before stating ‘sluts’ spread STD’s, you would have known that it is much easier for an infected man to pass an STD on to a woman, than it is for an infected woman to pass to a man. I will correct (one of) your mistake(s) for you now- UNPROTECTED SEX SPREADS STD’S, not ‘sluts’, and the solution to this is to use a condom, and get tested regularly by a doctor if you are engaging in sex on a casual basis. It takes two people to have sex, and each should be responsible for their own sexual health.

            You say the policeman has a right to ‘free speech’, but from a police officer this kind of talk should not be tolerated. If this is his belief, let it be so, but as a police officer his duty is to protect victims of crime, including rape, and saying women should avoid ‘dressing like sluts’ to prevent their rape is irresponsible. If that is his opinion he should keep it to himself while on duty. This public attack by an officer of the law takes the responsibility of sexual assault off perpetrators and onto women. When a woman is raped, who does she report it to? The police. Being the victim of a rape would be a traumatic experience, and it takes courage to come forward and report your attacker. If women feel they are going to be blamed by police for what happened to them, for ‘dressing slutty’, it would make it so much harder for the victim. Have some empathy, Jason. I’m sure if your mum or sister or female friend was unfortunate enough to be the victim of rape, I highly doubt that you would consider for a second blaming her, simply for what she was wearing.

            • May 17, 2012 at 5:31 pm #

              firstly I say that I think calling girls sluts is stupid. At the same time I feel the need to step in and debunk the things in your post that are borne more of passion than good sense.

              Thank goodness for citizen journalism, chauvinists like you can now rant to your hearts content, without an editor looking at the garbage you have presented and deciding, wisely, that such an under researched, innapropriate article is an embarrassment.

              You do not appear to understand the concept of “Freedom of Speech.” I am glad that citizen journalism has come about without the need for editors to vet the ideas that are in the hearts of thousands of passionate people.

              I would say that your post would not have escaped the scrutiny of an editor either. Lo and behold, Jason’s post is inflammatory and ill considered. Yet for him to grow, and for you, both need to be exposed to ideas. I’m glad you have been exposed to his.

              His words are a noose that can hang him for years to come. Yet words are words, and that is the beauty of free speech, where bad ideas are quickly shot down and devoured by good ideas. To stiffle this is to surrender to unreason.

              a small percentage of men are raped by women, but statistics show male-female rape is much higher,

              Are you implying that a man being raped by a woman is somehow less serious than a woman being raped by a man?

              More likely or not, both are of equal graveness. In fact, men would be equally stigmatised to admit that they had their dignity destroyed by rape from any quarter

              he is responsible for any attention he gets (wanted and unwanted) simply because he chose to wear something that

              Le sigh. Let me rephrase a more realistic scenario which I have repeated several times in this thread.

              If you are a man who dresses in Versace and has a $5000US laptop, and you walk down a dark alley full of robbers and thieves, would he be responsible for the attention he gets from said robbers and thieves?

              enjoy the right to wear whatever they like, can he use that as an excuse if he rapes a woman? No. No amount of justification can excuse rape, no excuse makes it ok

              This is the point that makes the slutwalk stupid

              Rape is inexcusable yes, we agree with you. At no point did Jason say that it was. BUT if you do not take steps to prevent risk , it doesn’t matter if “rape” was the fault of the rapist, you are still raped. A person who doesn’t take steps to prevent a compromising situation is negligent.

              I will give you a less confronting example that is equivalent.

              I cross the street when the crossing light is green for pedestrians. A car runs the red light, and I am killed. The driver is at fault BUT I am still dead. It doesn’t matter if I am right or wrong, I am still dead!

              So, when I cross the street, I check before I cross, even when the crossing light is green. Why? Because if I did not, I would be negligent in looking after my own safety.

              It doesn’t matter if I’m right or wrong, if the driver runs the light, I’m still dead.

              Two words: Risk management.

              Yes, I would be a victom. No, it’s not my fault, I got run over. But it is still in my interest to manage risk, because, even though it’s not my fault, I’d still be dead. That’s why concepts such as “defensive driving” exist.

              So, if you’re a girl going to the rougher side of town, ditch the cleavage and the Channel handbag that makes you look like a sitting duck. Even better, don’t go to that side of town.

              It is time to divorce fault from risk management. Because not managing risk is its own form of negligence, and its own lack of sense.

              I shouldn’t have to hide my valuables when I park my car at a shopping centre, why? If I get robbed, it’s not my fault, is it, it’s the robber’s fault! Lo, I still hide my valuables. I wonder why.

              unprotected sex spreads STD’s, did you not attend school?

              School teaches maths and a few other things besides, such as no form of contraception being 100% safe. The more you have sex and the more sexual partners you have, the more likely you are to contract an STD or someone will get pregnant. There are STDs that go around condoms as well (such as Herpes Simplex). There is always risk.

              how about placing some responsibility on men, too

              I agree that men should be more responsible and that there shouldn’t be a double standard. Nevertheless, men cannot get pregnant and be left holding the baby. Go figure.

              saying women should avoid ‘dressing like sluts’ to prevent their rape is irresponsible

              His words were poorly chosen… he’s a footsoldier paid to stand and protect, not to have scholarly discussion. It would be best to contact this policeman for comment, but I would suggest that he was simply expressing a cruder explanation for risk management.

              Cruder? Oh no, a cop being crude!

              I would quote Winston Churchill
              “We sleep soundly in our beds because rough men stand ready in the night to visit violence on those who would do us harm.”

              I’d rather a crude, tough policeman telling it as he sees it, than the santised, politically correct Doppelgängers that our social activists would see them replaced with. That is what happened to the police in Victoria under our last commissioner, Christine Nixon, who emasculated and weakened our police force.

              When you are hurt, and run crying to daddy… remember how he said, “there there, next time, I’ll get rid of that hornet nest for you.. don’t kick that hornet’s next, and you won’t get stung.” He is still loving as he admonishes you. Having empathy and speaking sense need not be mutually exclusive behaviours.

              • May 17, 2012 at 6:23 pm #

                Firstly- freedom of speech unfortunately applies to those with views that are not necessarily correct. Jason is entitled to say whatever he wants, as is the policeman, this does not make it right. Words are words, but when they come from someone in a position of authority and influence in society, comments should be fact based, and not opinion.

                Secondly, did I imply rape of women to be more significant? No. So stop making assumptions about what I believe, I am simply pointing out statistical evidence that women are more often the victims in rape.

                Third- we are not talking about robbers and thieves, we are talking about rape. To use this analogy is ridiculous, as is your ‘hornets nest’ example. Common sense and awareness of your surroundings are only going to help so much in prevention of rape. Not every victim of rape puts themselves in situations that may be unsafe- rapists don’t just prowl dark streets at night. Victims of rape cannot predict the actions of the rapist, wherever they are, whatever ‘risk management’ steps they take. If it was possible to look into the future and predict a rape, I’m sure there would be none. Walking down a dark alley alone at 3am is definitely not anything I would do- not just for the fear of being raped, but because common sense tells me it’s unsafe. Not all victims of rape are in situations of compromised safety.

                In response to the comment about the more sexual partners you have, the more likely you are to contract an STD- I see your logic here, but it is not always the case. A person could contract an STD with just one partner in the same way as a person could have slept with hundreds of people and not contract one. Statistical averages are just that- averages. What I was pointing out to Jason is that ‘sluts’ do not spread STD’s, unprotected sex does. There is a small chance you still may contract an STD or fall pregnant with condoms, however it will reduce the risk greatly.

                That policeman was not being crude, he was essentially condoning sexual attacks on women if they dressed a certain way. If you refer to my above post- ‘slut’ is subjective. A perception of ‘inappropriate attire’ will differ greatly from person to person, a woman has the right to wear whatever she wants without having to fear the advances of men she does not want.

                As for having empathy and speaking sense, Jason’s words were ‘honestly, I have has much sympathy for her as those soccer fans- nil’, his comments are not said in a loving, fatherly way. They are very clearly sending the message that if you exercise your right to about your life without ‘taking caution’ that you may be raped, then it’s your own fault. So, every woman should see men as potential rapists and be on guard at all times? Women do not want to treat men like every one of you could attack at any time- there is a small percentage of people who are rapists, what the victim does or doesn’t do has no bearing to the outcome. Are all victims of rape attractive, scantily clad women, drunkly stumbling around in the middle of the night, alone? No. Would this situation excuse a rape? Absolutely not.

                • May 18, 2012 at 6:29 am #

                  comments should be fact based, and not opinion.

                  What if I told you there was no such thing as fact, there is only opinion? Think about it. Everyone who presents information chooses the way they present it, and in doing so, makes it opinion. Even numbers, I can choose to present numbers in a spreadsheet in a way that conceals data and emphasises others.

                  In fact , we should encourage Jason to keep posting, so you can correct him and kick him in the arse. That’s good! Because ultimately, there is no true arbiter of what is “correct”. It would be very scary if that were true… what if the powers that be decided that you criticising Jason is “not correct” hence you are not allowed to do it? Freedom of speech, where bad speech is corrected by good speech.

                  simply pointing out statistical evidence that women are more often the victims in rape.

                  That “evidence” you have presented is irrelevant to the topic at hand unless you are implying that a woman being raped is more significant than a man being raped.

                  Common sense and awareness of your surroundings are only going to help so much in prevention of rape.

                  That statement is irrational and I suggest you would like to rethink that. I would say robbery and rape are equivalent, particularly from a security standpoint. You don’t need to change your mind, I will let the other readers decide.

                  That is the unreason that permeates the slutwalk. People see the word “rape” and take leave of their senses. Yes it is a horrendous crime, but the parameters of its execution and prevention are the same as many other violent crimes.

                  Not every victim of robbery puts themselves in situations that may be unsafe- robbers don’t just prowl dark streets at night. Victims of robbery cannot predict the actions of the robber, wherever they are, whatever ‘risk management’ steps they take. If it was possible to look into the future and predict a robbery, I’m sure there would be none. Walking down a dark alley alone at 3am is definitely not anything I would do- not just for the fear of being robbed, but because common sense tells me it’s unsafe.

                  I have tried an experiment with the above for you to illustrate my point.

                  The last line is the money line. Think about it… risk mitigation is common sense.

                  Not all victims of rape are in situations of compromised safety.

                  The one concession I will give you is this, from data collected through a social worker who is a close friend of mine. Most rapes are perpetrated by a person the victim knows, forcing their way into a house. The issue is the proverbial “dressing like a slut” does not play into that particular risk calculation.

                  Even then, there are steps you can take. For example, meeting a delivery man at the door and not letting him into the house, and keeping capsicum spray in your back pocket if you are paranoid. My friend no longer lets men she doesn’t know into her house as her risk prevention measure.

                  The police officer was referring to going out late at night to night clubs, getting trashed with all the wobbly bits hanging out, which is hardly encouragable behaviour. Women should be allowed to do that and have a great time, yes, but they are taking a risk. When your senses are compromised like that, you become party to almost anything a malevolent will wants to impose on you. It’s much easier to rob a drunk person, for example.

                  And you should know about police officers… in many juristictions in the world a police cadet is subject to an IQ test. If you score too low, you are made a constable, if you score high, you are made a detective. This senior constable may not have been the sharpest tool in the shed, his words are ill considered, but he is calling a spade a spade with colourful language. I’d rather he tell me that than stood silent as rapes continued without him saying anything.

                  Statistical averages are just that- averages.

                  I have to emphasise, from my previous article, that a woman having sex with more people doesn’t lose value in my eyes. Jason doesn’t share that view.

                  That being said, you can try to wave statistical averages away with your hand, but they won’t go away. Irregardless, the probability of contracting an STD increases with the number of sexual encounters you have, and the number of sexual partners makes the risk multiplicative. That is unavoidable.

                  he was essentially condoning sexual attacks on women if they dressed a certain way.

                  Le sigh. Your eyes and ears remain blocked. I believe women should wear whatever they like and go anywhere they want, I love beautiful women and that would be great for me.

                  Nevertheless, I know that there are bad men in the world out there to rape them. Telling my daughter to “cover up” does not say to her that I condone her being raped, no, it says that I know there are bad men out there and I’d prefer if she didn’t increase her chances of encountering one. Understand?

                  then it’s your own fault.

                  Ask him again if that is what he means, I cannot speak for him. What I suggest he means, however, is that each person is responsible for their own personal safety and risk mitigation , because there are bad men out there.

                  So, every woman should see men as potential rapists and be on guard at all times?

                  Yes. Be alert, but not alarmed. There are simple steps that everyone can take to avoid being the victim of violent crime.

                  Are all victims of rape attractive, scantily clad women, drunkly stumbling around in the middle of the night, alone?

                  I would replace your irrelevant question with a better one:

                  Is an attractive, scantily clad woman, drunkly stumbling around in the middle of the night, alone more or less likely to be a victim of rape?

                  • May 19, 2012 at 6:42 pm #

                    How can you believe data showing women are more frequently the victims of sexual assault is skewed? All I am pointing out is the statistical evidence. I made no mention of the ‘seriousness’ of man-woman vs woman-man rape, ANY rape is wrong, and takes something much more valuable than a stupid wallet or laptop from the victim. Don’t trivialise rape by comparing the two.

                    Also, why do you choose to discard statistical evidence, except in the case where your close friend, a social worker, told you the facts. This is contradictory.

                    Luckily, I don’t take suggestions from you, so I won’t be rethinking any statements or points of view I have on this matter. Whether a woman is in a potentially risky position or not, it does not make her rape any more or less her fault. This should not have to be a deciding factor in what a woman chooses to go or not to go.

                    In the ‘defence’ of the officer, sure, let’s let people in positions of authority who are meant to be trusted for victims of crime make statements like this, then excuse them because they are ‘probably’ stupid. Really? I know you would rather he ‘tell it like it is’- read- IN HIS OPINION- but do you think this is what a victim of rape wants to hear? No. They are in a vulnerable and fragile state, and the last thing on earth they need is to feel the judgement of those responsible for apprehending their attackers.

                    Of course each person is ‘responsible’ for their own safety, and most do take steps to avoid danger. But rapists are also responsible for what they do with their penis.

                    And what of the question of what a ‘slut’ is?? Who the fuck gets to decide this? Who gets to say one woman is dressed ‘slutty’ and ‘wants the attention’?? The whole argument Jason has put forth is stupid- ‘nobility in slut shaming’ is a ridiculous notion. What year are we living in? No one has the right to make anyone else feel ashamed for who they do or don’t sleep with. And if someone says no to unwanted sexual advances, it means NO. End of story.

                    • May 24, 2012 at 2:06 pm #

                      How can you believe data showing women are more frequently the victims of sexual assault is skewed? All I am pointing out is the statistical evidence…. ANY rape is wrong,

                      I would state again that the “statistical evidence” is entirely irrelevant to the topic at hand, unless you were somehow implying that a man raping a man is less significant than a man raping a woman, or any other combination. In fact, you admit as much in the phrase I have bolded.

                      Own goal, rachel.

                      takes something much more valuable than a stupid wallet or laptop from the victim. Don’t trivialise rape by comparing the two.

                      On the contrary, I never argued that rape and robbery are equivalent in seriousness, I am pointing out that they have the same security prevention, and that your argument is easily substituted from that standpoint. In that way, similarly, it also falls to the responsibility of the victim to mitigate risk is “common sense”. The word “rape” has entirely blinded you to reason. It reminds me of the time when, in the context of a debate, the word “nigger” was used respectfully to illustrate a point. An African American boy on the opposing side unravelled and became unhinged because he heard the word, and refused to consider the context in which it was uttered. That boy lost his side the debate as a result.

                      In an amusing collary… can you imagine the same insensitive policeman saying to a robbery victim, “well at least you weren’t raped”?

                      Also, why do you choose to discard statistical evidence, except in the case where your close friend, a social worker, told you the facts. This is contradictory.

                      I repeat that your statistical evidence proves no point, hence it is irrelevant and meaningless to the discussion at hand. Please try again by explaining precisely why that “evidence” you cite is pertinent at all. The only use I can see is to somehow show that some form of rape is more heinous than another, when I say that all forms of rape are equally heinous so distinguishing between them does not advance the argument at all. I have brought more information to the discussion because I am honest. The “facts” that my friend told me are contradictory to your case (forced entry from a known assailant has little to do with “dressing like a slut on a night out”), so why are you so quick to latch onto them? You grasp at straws.

                      I say to you that you cannot win by substituting reason with relentless filibuster. When your argument is more logically consistent, perhaps readers will judge that your words mean something.

                      This should not have to be a deciding factor in what a woman chooses to go or not to go.

                      I agree, in a perfect world, this should not factor into a woman’s decision at all.

                      Unfortunately, this is an imperfect world where bad men (rapists) exist. As an adult, it is incumbant on me to use common sense and to take responsibility to reduce the risk to my person, whether from rape, from robbery or any other malady that a bad person would visit on me. I cannot be responsible for the perversity in a brigand’s mind. Wouldn’t you agree?

                      A man can rape you, and it is the man’s fault entirely. It does not change the fact, however, that you were raped. It is better to prevent this happening by taking responsibilty for your own security, because the world is imperfect. No one can have armed guards protecting them 24/7, so responsibility is important. Wouldn’t you agree?

                      do you think this is what a victim of rape wants to hear? No

                      If a child kicked a hornet nest, and the father did not tell the child that it’s not a great thing to do in future, wouldn’t the father be negligent? Isn’t he passing “judgement” on his child? I would say it is better to give frank and fearless advice.

                      There is no right in this society on “not to be offended.” The right “not to be offended” is anathema to free speech.

                      The policeman was blockheaded in what he said, but I’d prefer he said that than said something to feather the behinds of those who really should be taking more responsibility for their choices, and their safety.

                      No one has the right to make anyone else feel ashamed for who they do or don’t sleep with. And if someone says no to unwanted sexual advances, it means NO. End of story.

                      I agree that people should sleep with whom they want, and wrote an article on this site to this effect. Not because we have some “right not to be offended”, but because it is stupid to try to be morally superior on this topic- it is akin to shooting yourself in both feet.

                      At the same time, two important observations.

                      Firstly, we have to understand the long term demographic impacts of allowing sexual freedom. There may be long term consequences, some of which are undesirable. It is not wise to make procreation abnormal or for the state to intervene too much in that topic, but the state still has an interest to the point where the long term health of the state is to be decided. If we have an epidemic of broken families due to the advent of sexual freedom, and the aftermath is that members of those families become wards of the state, it becomes unwise to promote sexual freedom to the degree all would want.

                      Secondly, who are the most vicious proponents of the word “slut”? Women. Women judging other women for betraying the sisterhood. Studies support this.

                      If women want equality, they need to accept all of equality, both that which is good and that which forces them to act on the same level as those they insist they are equal with.

      • Kathy
        May 31, 2012 at 10:46 pm #

        ‘I only feel responsible to me, my feelings and my needs.’

        And yet we should trust your voice regarding female sexual safety?

  39. May 15, 2012 at 1:25 am #

    I love this prick’s twisted, and completely FAILed logic, which amounts to this:
    “Hey, bitches, it’s your responsibility to keep yourselves chaste and pure, so irresponsible men can come along and fuck you safely, without using any protection”.
    Nice one.
    Here’s a suggestion, mate. If you’re such a loser that the only women you get to fuck, are kind-hearted promiscuous women who take pity on you and throw you a sympathy fuck – well, it’s your responsibility to protect yourself, you arsehole. So, be grateful, put on a condom, and shut the fuck up.
    Let’s be clear here. You are a mysogynist loser. That is not just my opinion, it is a fact. It is a logical and inescapable conclusion, deduced from your views as expressed in the vile tract you have vomited forth here.
    It is completely and utterly unsupportable, to blame what you term “slutty” women for STDs and unwanted pregnancies. No matter how promiscuous they are. Every single time a woman irresponsibly has unprotected sex, there is a man involved who is being just as irresponsible. That is a general and empirical fact.
    If you want to single out specific examples, in which the woman is more at fault than the man – eg, where a woman knows she has an STD, and the guy asks if she is STD-free and she lies and says sure yeah of course it’s all safe. Then sure, that woman deserves a kick up the arse. but for every woman who does that, there is a guy who has done the same thing, and who is just as culpable. For every woman who is guilty of saying sure, yeah, I’m on the pill don’t worry about getting me pregnant – when she isn’t on the pill – there will be a guy who has said sure honey, it’s ok if you’re not on the pill, I’ll pull out before I blow. And then he doesn’t.
    So, get a clue, fuckwit. The problems you’re blaming on (female) “sluts” – STDs, and unwanted pregnancies, are just as much the fault of men, as women. It is logically impossible, in general, to blame women more than men. Especially when men usually have more power in this society, and when men use that power to pressure women into unprotected sex.
    So, you are a misogynist prick, who has failed miserably in his attempt to do blame women for these problems. And, you’re a good looking guy too aren’t you? So, you better hope I don’t ever see you walking the street in a pair of sexy shorts, or, you may just unleash my latent homosexual side – and I may just give you the violent butt-fisting that you so obviously desire.

    • May 15, 2012 at 1:12 pm #

      aside from the vitriol, you have a point that men should shoulder responsibility as well. It takes two people to bump hips and make babies, not one. If both choose to bump hips, they are exercising free-will and have to take responsibility for the consequence as well.

    • May 16, 2012 at 12:22 am #

      John, leave the language out of it – if you can help it. You’re not doing yourself or your supporters any favours. That, and you seem to have completely made up what you want the piece to mean for yourself, so good for you I guess, but there are more intelligent discussions of it here (critical and not critical) that don’t resort to personal attacks.

  40. Paul Gibson
    May 15, 2012 at 9:02 pm #

    Jason, why don’t you leave blogging to those who have some sense of the world, not just their own importance. Your opinion piece is pure rubbish. You have completely missed the point. I suggest you go back and do some research, or even maybe, shock horror, interview someone and find out why they are doing something, rather than just making assumptions.

  41. Anonymous
    May 15, 2012 at 9:04 pm #

    Jason, don’t kid yourself; you’re not a journalist, just an ugly stain on the internet map. Perhaps I should follow your advice and provide other bloggers with the information that you’re a massive slut-shaming pig.

  42. Freya
    May 15, 2012 at 9:08 pm #

    Of the many things that are so wrong with this article I will only go into a couple. First what actually defines a slut to you? If a woman is promiscuous but always makes sure to use protection so as not to contract STD’s or get pregnant (which should be the responsibility of the man also) is she still considered a slut? And if so how is doing that harmful to anyone, or society as you have said? Second what would be an appropriate attire for women to wear so as not to attract rapists? This whole logic is completely ridiculous. Young women who dress in a sexy manner are not the only women to be victims of rape. And whether or not a woman is dressed in this way, if she is approached by a man and she clearly declines an interest it is the responsibility of the man to back the fuck off. If these men are so weak that they simply can’t help themselves when they see a beautiful woman wearing a short dress, then clearly the problem in society is with men, not women!

  43. May 15, 2012 at 9:10 pm #

    Of the many things that are so wrong with this article I will only go into a couple. First what actually defines a slut to you? If a woman is promiscuous but always makes sure to use protection so as not to contract STD’s or get pregnant (which should be the responsibility of the man also) is she still considered a slut? And if so how is doing that harmful to anyone, or society as you have said? Second what would be an appropriate attire for women to wear so as not to attract rapists? This whole logic is completely ridiculous. Young women who dress in a sexy manner are not the only women to be victims of rape. And whether or not a woman is dressed in this way, if she is approached by a man and she clearly declines an interest it is the responsibility of the man to back the fuck off. If these men are so weak that they simply can’t help themselves when they see a beautiful woman wearing a short dress, then clearly the problem in society is with men, not women!

  44. Josh
    May 15, 2012 at 10:49 pm #

    This is a fairly ridiculous article, an opinion piece is generally hopefully on a topic someone has an at least acceptable amount of knowledge in which I’m afraid you do not. A simple amount of research would bear the fruit of knowledge that raping is not a sexually motivated act in most cases, it is about exerting power over another individual. This is why the clothing choice usually doesn’t even matter, the bigger choice/problem is putting yourself into a situation where you’re alone or in an area without proper lighting/etc/etc.

    You also didn’t touch on the fact that the cops comment was directed AT A RAPE VICTIM… it was not an off hand comment about random people that upset those overly sensitive feminists… this cop was berating and insulting a now traumatized woman for being raped instead of talking about the guy being a power hungry asshole. See why people would get upset about it now? I hope so… (though I won’t be surprised if you don’t, if I may be honest).

    There’s a lot more wrong with your article but I don’t have the time or patience to go through it all, I hope you think more carefully about these subjects. Playing the devils advocate has it’s place but this topic is generally not one of them.

  45. VulvaSaur
    May 15, 2012 at 11:06 pm #

    Wow, you must have a really small dick. I dress like a slut sometimes, and I carry around a crowbar at all times – which I embed in the skulls of idiots who try to objectify me or sexually harass me. Not that you’d ever have the balls to approach a girl who looks like me. You’d just gawk at me from afar and then go back to your mother’s basement and fap.

    • Lo
      May 16, 2012 at 3:26 am #

      Dude, can we stay away from the ‘small dick’ comments and keep to what’s relevant?

    • May 16, 2012 at 9:25 am #

      “I carry around a crowbar at all times – which I embed in the skulls of idiots who try to objectify me or sexually harass me.”

      Wow, clearly the feminists are wrong when they say there’s no excuse for violence, you’ve found one!

      • May 25, 2012 at 11:07 am #

        At least she’s being responsible for her own safety lol

    • Kathy
      May 18, 2012 at 3:15 am #

      Wow, you…you sound like a psychopath.

      Also, yeah, it would be ridiculous for ANYONE to ‘objectify…a woman who looks like me.’

    • LLLookAtYouHacker
      June 30, 2012 at 5:16 am #

      Just because a man finds a woman attractive doesn’t make him sexist. There’s a difference between degrading objectification and innocent biological attraction.

  46. VulvaSaur
    May 15, 2012 at 11:10 pm #

    Oh yeah, and unlike you, my boyfriend is a sniper who has served in Afghanistan (six confirmed kills) and seen firsthand the effects of misogyny like yours. And unlike you he is a real man, not some keyboard warrior who’s butthurt because some girl refused to suck his cock or a woman got promoted at work over him.

    • May 27, 2012 at 3:50 pm #

      Summary: “Real men slay VulvaSaurs and kill people, but cannot articulate themselves in writing”.

  47. Tobi
    May 16, 2012 at 12:19 am #

    the reason women are talking about rape is because slutwalk is a march against attitudes surrounding RAPE. attitudes like yours. yes yours. you cant just say things like i have no sympathy for someone whos raped if they acted like a slut and then say you think its bad. no you dont. you condone rape with the things you say. its pretty simple. i live in australia so the stats are different but over here its estimated about less that 20% of rapes are reported. of that percentage less than 1% of those criminals see the inside of a jail. because of attitudes like yours. what if the judge thought the same as you. oh i have no sympathy because she was wearing a nice dress. i have read your whole article and all the comments so dont try and act like i havent heard you out either. your attitudes about rape are wrong. you condone rape. one in three women are raped and 1 in 5 men. and i care just as much about men being raped as women. but you have to understand wether youre a man or woman it would be very hard to tell anyone about it for fear of shame. slutshaming for example. because of attitudes like yours. you cant make up excuses for rapists (like what a woman was wearing or doing) and then say you dont encourage rape. like you said in some other paper TOLERATING an act is as bad as encouraging it. you do you tolerate rape you say oh it doesnt matter it will always happen so who cares. another thing yes of course the police keep records of what a victim was wearing pretty standard procedure. yes women in burqas are still raped. we all know rape has nothing to do with what the person was wearing. you said it yourself, you have no sympathy for a “slut” who is raped. you DID say that you cant weasel out of this one. oh and another thing i run a slutwalk protest group and none of our members dress provocatively (we live in a cold climate and even if it was hot i prefer to dress modestly) and neither do i and our group is not about saying women can do what they want its about saying women can do what they want without being blamed for being raped. women are blamed for rape. the cop who said women shouldnt dress like sluts if they dont want to rape basically said that 1. he has the same attitude as you. 2. he doesnt know much about actual rapes and 3. that people who get raped are obviously all sluts. slutwalk is a movement against the attitudes that surround rape. attitudes like yours. one in three women has been raped. female friends of yours have been raped they just havent told you because they know you wouldnt care.

  48. Tobi
    May 16, 2012 at 12:28 am #

    oh and telling someone who has actual experience with rape to not share… good word dude. i wonder why less than 20 percent of rapes are reported? hmmm? she has experience with rape you dont so her opinion on the matter has more weight than yours

  49. Fu
    May 16, 2012 at 12:31 am #

    What a bullshit article! Detailed response coming! The “man” who wrote it is clearly wrapped up in resentment and hatred of women. My favorite bs excuse for logic “life is more dangerous now” than it was historically. That is why our life expectancy has grown from 40 to 70.

  50. Lo
    May 16, 2012 at 3:24 am #

    I love the irony of the person who writes “because it is more “empowering” to depend on a massive faceless state machine for protection and money than to depend on a man you can talk with, if and when, you want to, excuse my sarcasm” (ignoring the fact that maybe aforementioned woman wants to be, I dunno, dependent on herself)

    …and then claims it is noble to try to regulate another person’s personal life, #1-3.

    Should we publicly shame people for every activity that carries some risk? Are people not to decide what to do with their own personal lives?

  51. May 16, 2012 at 3:37 am #

    “Its a dangerous, complicated and ruthless world, and the best defense is to be responsible and to act responsibly, and that’s going to have to mean using a lot more self-control than is comfortable most of the time. But you either accept that, or you accept that sooner or later your irresponsible decisions will eventually kill you, if not countless others collaterally, on the way to your eventual demise.”

    It’s going to take a while, but it WILL happen.

  52. Anonymous
    May 16, 2012 at 7:20 am #

    ok im going to spell it out again for another rape condoner. thinking that women are responsible in any way for rapes reguardless of what they were wearing is condoning rape. pretty simple

    • May 17, 2012 at 12:45 pm #

      I’m going to spell it out again for another person who thinks they got an education instead of an indoctrination. This is an article about sluts and slutwalk, not rapists and rape. I am not condoning rape and no one here has commented to suggest that rape is acceptable.

  53. Anonymous
    May 16, 2012 at 10:55 am #

    This article is ridiculous. This article will embarrass the author for eternity.

  54. Anonymous
    May 16, 2012 at 11:08 am #

    I am actually sickened that you are so uninformed about this and yet consider yourself an authority on the matter. Obviously you do not understand the reasons for SlutWalk – or do you honestly think that women ask to be raped? Also, your misunderstanding of what happened with Rush Limbaugh and Sandra Fluke would be laughable if it wasn’t so contemptible. Ms Fluke wasn’t saying that America should pay for women to have sex, she was saying that her government should be helping women pay for their necessary medication. Did you watch her testimony at all.

    Please, before posting something like this again, do some research. If you still believe this is correct, say what you want to say. But don’t take facts out of context simply to support a view you already have. As a scientist, I would have expected you to test what could DISPROVE your hypotheses (that slut shaming is good), rather than simply twist facts to prove your hypotheses.

  55. Leper Corn
    May 16, 2012 at 1:59 pm #

    Hi Jason, it appears to me that what you’re calling for is this:

    1. Women should dress more conservatively to avoid potentially causing an assault.

    2. If we install this as a social expectation on all women (conservative dress to avoid exciting men to rape) we very quickly arrive at living in a hard line Islamist regime (Taliban perhaps?) where women are required to be completely covered. The logic that has evolved over centuries to create the fundamentalist Muslim ideal is the same logic that you’re embarking on now.

    3. Are you saying that that is the kind of society that you want to live in?

    4. I’m very happy to live in a free and relaxed society/country where people can wear what they want, vote how they want, read what they want, work in the profession they choose and generally live in a state of comfort and happiness. If the price that I have to pay to live in a world like that is to learn how to not rape a woman when I see an exposed thigh then I’m prepared to learn that skill and pay that price, so that we all have a free place to live.

    4. Are you saying you’d prefer to live in a society full of constrictions akin to fundamentalist Islamic law? If so there are plenty of lovely places you could go to live in this dream place of yours. Iran maybe? I could book you a flight.

    5. To ensure my society is safe and free I make a daily effort not to rape women who dress provocatively. I’m happy to pay this price. What do you do on a daily basis to contribute to the great western democratic tradition?

    I’ve included some humour here, but also some very serious questions. If you or your supporters are able to respond to those sincere queries I’d be delighted,

    Thanks.

    • May 16, 2012 at 6:10 pm #

      Your point number 2 is very, very good.

      • Leper Corn
        May 16, 2012 at 7:45 pm #

        Cool ok, so we agree that we want to (and do) live in a society where people are free to dress how they want to. All that remains is for everyone to behave politely and considerately and not rape / bash / assault anyone, of any gender, for any reason. And come on, we all know that there’s no justification for violence in any situation other than warranted self defense.

        Jason mate it seems to me that you’re dealing with some personal issues by projecting anger outwards instead of looking inward to find what exactly is making you feel dissatisfied and frustrated. It’s ok to feel owned and trod upon by society and the power of female sexuality, all every-day men experience this regularly. What makes you a noble individual is how you process and deal with those experiences.

        No matter what fine details we quibble over, there is never, in any way at all, a way to justify or defend violence.

        You say you’re in favour of free speech and personal freedom, but from what I can gather you’re trying to garner a ground swell of support for a western Islamic-esque crack down whereby civil liberties are curtailed and dress codes enforced so that you can feel less threatened by your own sexual urges or inadequacies.

        Maybe a psychologist or sex therapist could help you work through the anger issues.

        I mean that in all sincerity.

        I love the fact that I can walk down the street and see a woman strolling about in heels and flowing dress. I wouldn’t want to lose that at all, and I get the feeling you’re trying to use the lowest common ape of a man as a reason to take this joy away from me.

        I never get laid, and feel frustrated pretty much 24/7, but this is a way better reality than living in some kind of extreme socially conservative hell where we can only talk to women through veils of fabric. Imagine how frustrated those same men would be then! I reckon sexual assaults would increase under that kind or repressed pressure, so we’re better of staying as we are and just behaving like civilised human beings!

        Viva la freedom.

        God bless the mothers, sisters and cute babes of the world.

        • May 20, 2012 at 9:43 am #

          Dude, you need to go to the man cupboard and pour yourself a glass of self-respect and take a couple of shots.

          “It’s ok to feel owned and trod upon by society and the power of female sexuality, all every-day men experience this regularly.”

          No, it’s not ok to feel owned and trod upon by society. It’s not ok for men to experience this regularly. Get to your fucking feet and stand up for yourself! If you don’t want to walk this Earth with your head held high then shut the fuck up and go back to you room and don’t annoy me or anyone else with your pathetic wailing.

          People will ultimately treat you the same way you treat yourself, if you don’t respect yourself, no one will respect you.

          • Anonymous
            May 20, 2012 at 10:45 am #

            You’ve picked upon a point of humour (where I’m attempting to make light of the potential cause of your rather scary aggression towards women) but completely ignored my first and main point. Do you not have a response to my assertion that what you’re in fact calling for is in reality a move towards some type of oppressive totalitarian regime much like the one that we’ve just spen billions on trying to remove from power in Afghanistan? I know you’re going to say that that is ridiculous, but that is the direction that your logic would take us. Please respond intellectually, not emotionally.

            • May 20, 2012 at 12:18 pm #

              My rather scary hatred of women? You’re making a lot of assumptions there. I don’t hate women, but I don’t put then on pedestals either. They fart, poo, cheat, lie, steal, screw up and fuck around the same as any man does. Might I suggest that because you have a romantic view of women this makes my realistic perspective of women appear extreme when it’s not at all.

              As for your point about creating an Islamic cultural enclave in the West go read my article on Islam. I’m not telling women what to wear, and I have interest in doing so. They can walk around naked for all I care, but if they’re not going to take responsibility for their actions I’m content to let nature filter the idiotic women out of the gene pool.

  56. Kate
    May 16, 2012 at 3:53 pm #

    Jason Sutherland, I have been attacked and raped, and I can assure you that what you have put forth on this web page scares me more than the memory of that heinous day. You seem to think that an understandable reaction to sluttiness (however you want to define it) is frustration, which is naturally expressed by a man by forcing his penis into a stranger’s vagina or rectum. Unless you suffer an affliction – epilepsy for example – there is no reason whatsoever for visual stimuli to cause violent and uncontrollable reactions.
    It’s clear to me that you find rape abhorrent, but to rationalize it by demonizing slutty girls is bizarre, dangerous, and completely off the mark. Wearing a skanky outfit harms noone; raping someone causes pain and terror for years. Please consider.

    • May 18, 2012 at 9:12 am #

      Kate, I have been attacked and fought off a rapist once and on another occasion I was kidnapped with the intention to rape me. In both situations I asserted myself, fought back and forgot the whole experience. I don’t brag about it, I don’t harp on about it, I’m just glad I’m alive, I survived and I’ve learned to stay away from weirdos. Sure, it wasn’t my fault I was attacked, but dammit, when I look back I can see that I made bad decisions with the company I chose to keep.

      This is the point I keep saying over and over again, and I don’t care if you’ve been raped before, it is irrelevant to this discussion and you are purposely disrupting it with an overly emotional distraction from the point: rape is still a crime, but we live in an imperfect and unjust world where it is up to us individually to look out for our own safety and well being. What you and many others here are demanding is world free of responsibility, sorry, no. I’m not responsible for your safety, and nor is anyone else.

      • May 18, 2012 at 9:31 am #

        rape is still a crime, but we live in an imperfect and unjust world where it is up to us individually to look out for our own safety and well being. What you and many others here are demanding is world free of responsibility, sorry, no. I’m not responsible for your safety, and nor is anyone else.

        I agree with this statement (and I rarely agree with Jason). The police cannot be holding your hand 24/7, nor would you want them to. You need to look after yourself first, that is a person’s first responsibility, man or woman, senior or child.

        If you are incapable of defending yourself in a physical altercation one needs to take other steps to guarantee security through prevention or other arrangements. Riling about a confected “right” does not change this.

      • Kathy
        June 19, 2012 at 2:12 am #

        JASON WHY ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT YOUR EXPERIENCES NOBODY CARES STOP OVERSHARING CHRIST

        • June 23, 2012 at 9:37 am #

          lol!

          Context my dear, context. I was responding to someone else and it was relevant to the discussion. Nor did I bring it up to get any sympathy. I don’t need any. I’m independent and self-sufficient.

      • megan
        August 17, 2015 at 3:15 am #

        “This is the point I keep saying over and over again, and I don’t care if you’ve been raped before, it is irrelevant to this discussion”

        Only true cowards would say that online because they know they can get away with it. If you were face to face with Kate, you’d never have the balls to say that, because you know how scummy that is. For the record, you’re the one who mentioned rape in your dumb article first, therefore her comment is very relevant.

  57. May 18, 2012 at 7:27 am #

    I went to a feminist picnic the other day.
    It was great, apart from the fact no one made any sandwiches.

  58. Life Life
    May 24, 2012 at 12:17 am #

    Gave it 6 stars. But where I live, it would get zero. Zero because integrity, truth and wisdom are regarded as a sign of “false consciousness” in NYC. One point, though. Slut get-ups are useful. They indicate that I am viewing an abortion-scarred bar-hopper who must be avoided like the plague. Slut get-ups = a sign saying “Radioactive Waste – Stay Out.”

  59. Wendy
    May 25, 2012 at 3:11 pm #

    I have no problem with a woman having multiple sexual partners, so long as she does so responsibly and keeps it to herself. I do not understand the point of bragging about your sexual exploits, as a woman. I think feminists need to realize that, yes, women are wired differently, and, therefore, there is a difference between a woman bragging about her sexual exploits and a man bragging about his sexual exploits. First, we have to look at why someone would brag about sexual activity. Because they think the listener will be jealous? Women are not often jealous of other women’s conquests. Men might be of other men, so it is understandable. To make the listener want to engage in sex with the braggart? Men don’t brag about their sexual exploits to women, because they know women don’t want to hear it. And if a woman brags about her exploits to a man, what is the point? If she wants to have sex with him, she doesn’t have to tell him about her past partners. She can just flirt and smile or even just flat out say “I think you’re sexy. Do you want to come back to my place?” Therefore, the only reason that I can fathom a woman bragging about her sexual exploits (and I’m not talking about giggly girl talk with a confidant) is that she wants men to think of her in a sexual way, and that this is the only way she believes she can get men to think of her at all. It reeks of attention whoring and low self esteem. The same is true of dressing provocatively. I agree with your metaphor about the soccer players and the girl in a seedy bar, although I would still feel somewhat sympathetically for her. When a woman dresses that way, letting her breasts and ass hang out, she is saying “These parts of me are what I have to offer. Admire them, please.” Which I find outrageous, because it’s not something she had any control over. You can control whether or not you have an intelligent opinion about the latest news story, but not whether or not you have breasts (unless you get a boob job, which again — you need double Ds to feel good about yourself?). Anyway, my point is, sleep around if you want, but there’s no reason to show off the goods to everybody and make sure everyone knows about your sexual exploits. Also, I realize this is a very late response, but I was looking up slut shaming.

  60. Simon W
    May 26, 2012 at 4:49 pm #

    Vulvasaur? I suggest you DON’T tempt fate Miss or ALL the Ironbars & Sniper Boyfriends/Real Men in the WORLD won’t help you since the Law of Averages says? If you go out Looking for Trouble Miss? You WILL find it & you for some reason? Seem to be Asking for trouble trying to take on the world & spitting fire like this & God? Has a way of paying such people back with precisely that – Trouble. Think you should tone it down a little MIss – there’s no need to insult people on here to get your point across – unless of course? Your pathetic so-called ‘point’? Has No value & your are Only shouting such rubbish as you did to Blind us to that fact – Is That it Miss? Because to me? The fact you talk in the one breath about women “Refusing to give BJ’s or being promoted over a man” is all well & good for your supposed support for women but by then going on about your BF being a so-called “Real man” & talking about “small D*cks” etc?

    Well by doing that? Aren’t you then promoting JUST the sort of society view that you women CLAIM to HATE? That of ‘Real Men’/Strong men etc with weaker small D*cked men below them Not getting near what do you Yanks call it? ‘Laying’ women due to their so-called weakness? Or do you ONLY hate those ideas regarding men objectifying women (which ‘strong men’ like your BF presumably is do All the time) when they DON’T apply to you or your loved ones but are available for YOU to use against others? Because that’s what it looks like to me Miss. Oh & I suggest you learn a saying we hear used here quite a lot Miss that Might apply to what you say & some of the rubbish you put above? “One man’s Haagen Daaz? Is another man’s poison” – What’s good for one man? Might not be for another – the Same applies to women yes? So someone You describe as being small d*cked or weak with women/no good at ‘pulling’ them? Might in fact have had Loads of GF’s or be the idea to some woman of what They think is the God of Love no? You just Don’t know Do you?

    Anyway because of that? I think it’s rather stupid of You to PRESUME isn’t it? Take me for instance – Hardly a prime physical specimen now & a bit of a wreck well into my thirties – not the sort of man you think would attract women & certainly not someone fitting with your ridiculous idea of a so-called ‘real man’ Vulvasaur no? (Not any more anyway) Yet I? Have just finished a 6 year engagement & am now in another long-term relationship with a loving woman – 2 Long term relationships lasting over 6 years in total & one still ongoing; Well I ask you Vulvasaur – How do you explain that given the fact I’m a physical wreck who spends a LOT of time on painkillers? Can’t CAN you? Anyway all this? Well, that’s what little old Me thinks anyway from my base at home here in the UK.

    Who is ME or more accuarately Who am I? Well I’m Simon & all you need to know for here is I’m from the UK & Someone whose partially disabled now & spends my life on & off PK’s I never used to have much in the turn of Ladies though things Have improved since my 20’s & I have a Girlfriend right now whose a nursery teacher & have just finished a 6 year relationship with a fiancee who was more violent than many MEN I know & smashed the hell out of me numerous times – Also Vulvasaur? I did & Passed ALL the tests for the British Army & Marines (tests that put even the Vaunted US Seals to shame – WHO do you think taught them?) When younger & Only didn’t get in due to being asthmatic so I know a thing or two about combat to (a ‘Real Man’ by Your standards perhaps?) & over here for women? It’s a different World now with much of what is being mentioned on this comments section regarding women fearing men & men being a threat to them? Reversed & then some……….

    Let me tell you now due to a number of female favouring laws & administrations in the UK? Men have to go out & be every BIT as careful OF women as women do of them since women here now? Are VERY violent & very often dress jsut as the article author says denotes them as ‘sluts’ – Far more over here to? They ACT the part as well & sleep with many different men with gay abandon – Rarely Caring about who they hurt or the fathers of their children or the children growing up in broken homes. There are Many, many men here like me who regularly get battered by their partners (as my ex did with me), glassed in nightclubs, knifed, attacked by women in groups, all sorts but because we’re men? It’s often ignored or we’re told “put up with it”. Even False Rape Claims are Very fast becoming a weapon of choice for this Hellish Generation of Entitlement Driven/Feminist Dominated women here as the recent case of Kirsty Sowden (google her) shows.

    Oh yes, Men Still commit crime, threaten & hurt women here don’t get me wrong but the numbers in EITHER direction? Are now far, far closer together than they were with assaults ON men BY women? Increasing daily. Don’t mistake me to? Wonderful, caring, genuine mature, Adult women exist to as my darling GF shows but more & more here? The results of a feminist driven government & legal agenda are becoming clear with every man who reports at A & E at their local hospital with an ‘unexplained’ injury, every domestic the police attend that a WOMAN has started or attacked the MAN during or every False Rape Claim that is filed & man’s life that is destroyed as a result.

    As to the Article? I think it’s a woman’s business WHO she sleeps with & goes out to see & How she dresses? But If she’s GOING to dress in certain ways & then COURT danger by going near people she KNOWS will be ‘turned on’ or attracted to her While she’s dressed like that? Then like the fool who sprays a gas flame with aerosol or deoderant or throws a match into a can of petrol? She should make herself VERY aware of & arm herself against the problems she might suffer because of those choices. Men & society in general? Should NOT be expected to police womens safety with regard to the results of situations they themselves have created – nor should we pick up the pieces every time for them of the results of their OWN lack of foresight or preparation.

    Some of the women on here make me laugh in fact – If they say WHY should they HAVE to go out prepared for trouble BECAUSE they’re dressed sexily or provocatively & then admit to carrying iron bars/going in groups/having special plans to Avoid trouble? Then they’re rather defeating their OWN arguments aren’t they? By MAKING those special plans/arrangements/obtaining weapons etc? Aren’t you going out prepared & acting BY preparing? In precisely the manner you question? That’s what it looks like to me anyhow……..

    The facts that women HAVE to plan in this way & take notice of these dangers & indeed the fact these dangers exist at ALL for them to take notice of? Are of course FAR different matters & ones that may take many years to change & which go right to the Heart of what is wrong with matters regarding women in public & their safety right now. In the end? I think only educating people of Both sexes from a young age & designing laws that are PROVEN to be effective in providing a Real deterrant for those sorts of behaviour are what will change things & That sort of change? WILL take generations – Indeed on that road? We’ve hardly yet even started but as they say? The longest journey begins with but a single step………….

    Anyway? That’s just MY Personal Views is all – Do read & see what you think. WHY am I Thinking after saying that? Here goes nothing? We shall see soon enough…………………..

  61. May 31, 2012 at 3:42 am #

    Jason, here’s my challenge to you.

    First, ask a first year Philosophy major to read your article and point out all the logical fallacies, unsupported claims, and straw-men in your rhetoric.

    Second, spend an afternoon volunteering at a rape crisis center or any other organization that supports sexual assault survivors. Or better yet, show your article to an actual sexual assault survivor and ask for their feedback.

    Your words sound like they come from someone who lives in misogynistic fantasy world. I wonder how much experience you have with sexual assault survivors or SlutWalk supporters.

    • Amfortas
      June 4, 2012 at 3:16 pm #

      This holier than thou attitude is almost laughable. A fine collection of shaming words there, David . One might even think you are a misandric bigot. But we may be mistaken. David, spend 20 years as a private practicing psychologist sorting out all the problems of the ordinary girls who have taken the self-styled slut path. Your ‘rape crisis centers’ are hotbeds of anti-male and anti-female hysteria, bent on creating a many ‘victims’ as they can…for the taxpayer dollar. The amount of work that has to be done to straighten out such girls would make your philosophy student eyes bleed.

    • June 23, 2012 at 3:52 pm #

      Are you asking me to come up with arguments against my position for you? Are you that inept?

      Sorry, I don’t do handouts. You’ll have to use your brain and come back to me with a reasoned response.

      • Bios
        July 5, 2012 at 9:02 pm #

        The joke is, i’ve never met a _real_ philosopher that believes in radical feminist ideas, and those are the ideas that have influenced social policy in the Anglosphere. I have friends that are philosophers, and they work in Australian universities. Not one of them believes in that garbage, although they do believe in quality, rather than domination, which is the real aim of radical feminism.

        • Amfortas
          July 5, 2012 at 9:13 pm #

          Yet the Philosophers in our Universities seem to put up with Radical feminists – like say, Sheila Jeffries – with their radical and man-hating views, which include menocide and aborting male babies, holding Professorial rank and being treated with all the privileges of office that they have. How many raise objections? Perhaps our philosophers are suffering from ‘Womyn Inclusive Mug Philosopher Syndrome’ – or wimps.

  62. so called slut
    May 31, 2012 at 4:34 am #

    Some say that slut shaming is necessary. I disagree, and for this reason. If during adolesance a girl is considered an outsider for any number of reasons excluding being a slut, slut bashing is an often used tool which individuals use to justify hating that person and harassing them. Before I was sexually active I joined a moved home and joined a school a year later than other students. I was extremely shy and found it difficult to make friends. My troubles were exacerbated by the bulling that began soon after my arrival at this school. I was called geek, loner and a host of other names; my taste in music accent and just about everything else was wrong. I made a few friends, but not many. When I left the school after a year the slut shaming began, please note, I still hadn’t had any form of encounter with the opposite sex. The unfortunate thing was that I lived in close proximity to the school and would often bump into ex classmates. It’s fascinating that a rumor with no legs will still find a way around. Before long I was known to everyone in the local area as a slut. I am constantly slut shamed, and I find it deeply frustrating that so many people have jumped on the band wagon and unquestioningly believed what they have heard. I consider it to be a form of bullying, which is why I strongly oppose it. It’s impossible to know everyone’s agenda, but I suspect there where people who saw an easy opportunity to isolate me further. If someone is considered a slut, rightly or wrongly, people assume that it is okay to psychologically abuse them and since when was bullying okay. The irony is that females that are considered good girls are often as sexually active as “sluts”, they have just perfected the art of concealing it. Your girlfriend/friend/sister is not necessarily going to confide in you that they have had 2 one night stands. So the next time you chose to brand someone a slut, please ask yourself the questions, how certain am I that they are a slut? Are/were they anymore sexually active than the discreet, sorry, “Good girls”?

    • May 31, 2012 at 9:54 am #

      qed

      that is why you don’t simply brand girls sluts… it’s based on hearsay.

  63. Cosy
    June 2, 2012 at 9:18 am #

    Rape occurs because somebody commits rape.
    Rape does not occur because of something the victim did for the simple fact that if somebody doesn’t rape her, she has not been raped.
    So in order for rape to happen, someone has to commit rape.
    Is that logical enough?

    I can maybe agree that the stripper look is sometimes misused by young women trying to obtain validation through male desire for them (simply because the society we live in teaches us that male desire is the ultimate and only validation we can EVER achieve, doesn’t matter if you become president, if you’re not sexually desirable you’re still worthless/fat/ugly and that’s the end of it, there goes your value down the toilet).
    But to say that rape occurs because we dress sexy is preposterous.

    To say that protesting should only occur in light of events, and not words, is however worse: it’s incredibly ignorant. Here’s why. Do you think the Inquisition just suddenly started burning women for witchcraft? That would have caused a revolution. So instead, they started by talking about witchcraft.
    Do you think Hitler just suddenly woke up and started killing Jews? No. First he talked about it for a good 7 years.
    Please be smarter than to claim I’m irrationally foreseeing a war on women.
    I am merely making valid examples on why WORDS NEED TO BE ARGUED BEFORE THEY BECOME ACTIONS.

    Words have the power to lead masses to actions. Especially if on newspapers. Especially if spoken by a state figure. In the specific case that led to the Slutwalk, his comment basically authorized any rapist to get out of it by claiming slut. For a police officer whose job should be to prosecute rapists and protect victims, to say that rape occurs because of something the victim does, is to imply that the police (he spoke as a policeman NOT as a citizen, please don’t pretend that doesn’t make a difference) believs the victim to be half responsible.
    That’s like saying that a house that was robbed is responsible for it for looking too pretty and cosy. That’s EXACTLY the same thing. A body is violated because somebody violates it.

    Plus your argument that Slutwalk is against freedom of opinion is by far the weaker, easier to turn around argument I have read in months. The cop was entitled to his own opinion. The feminists who protested were simply stating THEIR opinion, and made sure they allowed it the same media attention his one gained. His went on the papers and so did theirs. End of the story.

  64. Cosy
    June 2, 2012 at 9:49 am #

    You say you like to play devil’s advocate. Well, please be raped, then I will care to listen what you have to say about rape. You are insulting and degrading to all the men who find rape a dreadful thing. You seriously wrote that being financially deprived is worse then beign raped? how the FUCK would you know that? have you tried either? I’m pretty sure you haven’t been raped and by how you quickly shut up the only person in the comment who has, I am pretty sure you have NOT been doing any reasearch on it. How misinformed can you be? STDS being worse then ever? You call yourself a biologist, well THANK GOD you’re not claiming to be an historian as well or you would know that the incidence of stds is MINIMUM compared to ANY other age in history, since the invention of condoms. We are 7 billions now so OF COURSE there are MORE sick people, because there are more people IN GENERAL plus we have better diagnosing abilities now so we would KNOW it’s a STD. Dear GOD.
    If any of the women in your life or yourself had been raped you wouldn’t have dreamed of writing this. I am sure you will not even UNDERSTAND why you have enraged so many people including myself. You have NO idea what you are talking about, that was the problem to begin with.
    Comparing loosing money to rape.
    You disgust me.

  65. Sophia
    June 3, 2012 at 3:39 am #

    You know what? No. Just, no.

    I think it’s disgusting how this article marks the activity of ‘slut shaming’ as something noble, something justified – as something glorious. There is nothing honourable about shaming anyone for anything, under any circumstance – it’s petty, vicious and cruel, and will solve nothing.

    By saying that anyone who brings up having been sexually assaulted is bringing too much emotion into the discussion, you’re purposefully undermining any reaction that isn’t ‘I agree with you’, which really does not make for a fruitful discussion in any way. You’re implying that it’s not okay for these victims to share their experiences, and thus, I feel, trying to hedge yourself against those inevitable reactions telling you, ‘you know what, I’ve been assaulted, and what you’re saying here is not okay’. That is unfair, one-sided, and not how you’re supposed to behave in any discussion.

    I’m heartily sickened by this. Not angry or otherwise enraged – just sickened, and also saddened, to read this from someone who himself has been the victim of a sexual assault, and feels the need to even partly take the blame for it. It’s a sad characteristic of today’s society that this kind of victim-blaming is still being endorsed, and has taken such a degree of intensity that many victims themselves feel as if it is actually their fault.

  66. Amfortas
    June 4, 2012 at 3:07 pm #

    These sad women who describe themselves as ‘sluts’ and see it as a badge of pride, are some men’s daughters. It is an indictment of our modern society that fathers are forced out of their daughter’s lives so frequently and cannot give these young women a model of masculine virtue. The modern mother, with some or a few exceptions, provide the model upon which this ‘slutness’ is built.

    Yes, we can point the finger at these self-styled sluts and refelct the shame they bring upon themselves, but I do not wish to gloat. I feel sorry for them, even whilest holding them quite responsible for their own outlandish actions.

    The words to the ‘Stupid Girl’ song fit well.

  67. June 20, 2012 at 2:06 pm #

    I find this to be one of the most appallingly written, uninformed, insulting and ignorant articles I’ve ever read. Poor men, they are considered “privileged” so they can’t complain? Hmmm… that’s interesting because this article just looks like one massive whinge to me. Thank god I have never met anyone with your views because it seriously diminishes my faith in society and humanity when I see such vile hateful ignorance being broadcast with such arrogance. I hope one day you meet a person with the patience and understanding to change your mind, because I know that most people would instantly dismiss this BS.

    • June 23, 2012 at 9:10 am #

      Again. Lots of sound and fury, but no substance. If you want to refute my arguments you can’t just whinge and throw shallow insults, you actually need to think and provide rational counter arguments.

      In the exchange of ideas there are many currencies. Emotion and insults trade very poorly compared to logic and reason.

  68. Laura
    June 20, 2012 at 4:38 pm #

    Jason. How dare you tell a woman on here who shared her experience of rape that “that’s an awfully personal thing to be sharing with the rest of the world” and “no one on here needs to know that”… If we are going to ever remove one of the most harmful affects of a rape, the stigma and responsibility victims feel for their rape, we must start sharing our experiences so that others can feel that they have a support network and are not alone and the pitiable victim of a terrible scenario… How you can possibly think it’s ok to talk with such utter disregard for rape victims’ feelings then go on to admonish someone for “oversharing” is beyond me. Particularly as you, I see, have also shared your experience of rape on here. I am so sorry for you that that happened. It has happened to me too, twice. But I have never been ignorant enough as to generalise that all men are rapists or all women are victims. So get down off your high horse, try and understand that every person is different… And that, just as I hope people don’t judge the men’s movement on your ridiculous rants, one mustn’t judge the feminist movement on some of its more fundamentalist, or extremist, voices- which are usually
    magnified thanks to the media’s sensationalism. The meaning of feminism is the movement towards equality between the sexes. Do you disagree with that? Before you start making any claims about how disenfranchised men are, or how women are abducting their children, or making them live in sexless marriages or marginalising them because of their innate sexuality, DO YOU agree with equality of the sexes? If so, we’re on the same page. You can stop getting off on “playing devil’s advocate” now because it doesn’t matter. You can stop infuriating and hurting people who have been raped or people who have been vilified for being a “slut” before… Because it’s pointless. Why don’t you walk outside of your house, open your mind and shut your mouth. You might meet a nice slut to settle down with.

    • June 23, 2012 at 9:34 am #

      I like hearing this kind of shaming language these days because I don’t feel ashamed of who I am and also it tells me my rhetorical opponent is pretty desperate if that’s the only counter argument they have.

      Firstly, when something bad happens, be it rape, assault, burglary etc, one can either just assess the damage, grieve for the loss and move on or one can obsess over it until becomes part of who they are. Hello, I’ve been raped, that makes me a lifelong victim, as such I expect your lifelong sympathy and obedience to my mood swings.

      Fuck that shit. You got raped, so what? Rape is no different to being violently assaulted and far more men are held down and beaten to within an inch of their lives than women are raped. Those men don’t expect to be coddled for the rest of their lives and nor should women who have been raped. Anyone who adopts the identity of self-selected victim is a parasite. A lot of feminists who claim to be raped talk about it as a badge of honour: look at me, I was raped, now I’m a lifelong victim woohoo! Victimhood, yeah! Now I may mooch off the milk of human kindness!

      By all means try to shame me for saying that, but you’re wasting your time. I’m not a lump of jelly. You need to use stronger weapons than emotions. You need to use logic and reason to breach my walls.

      Do I believe in equality if the sexes?

      Depends on what you mean. In dignity and rights? Yes, I do.

      In physical strength, intellect and productivity? No. Men are clearly superior to women in those three areas on average. Not that there aren’t female athletes, geniuses and hard workers out there, that’s certainly true. But they’re outnumbered my men by almost 10 to 1. This fact is so blatantly obvious when one looks about the world if you can’t see it then you’re living in a very small box with restricted reading materials.

      • LLLookAtYouHacker
        June 30, 2012 at 5:06 am #

        “Rape is no different to being violently assaulted.”

        I’m speechless.